Maximizing Manure As A Crop Input
30 Nov 2240 min 19 sec

With elevated fertilizer prices the new norm and even questions of availability of synthetic fertilizers, manure has become quite popular. But what do we know now about manure that we didn’t as recently as a few years ago as it pertains to application rates, nutrient availability, and preserving the nutrients after manure application? Dave Kaltenberg with Agrotech USA sits down for an informative discussion on maximizing manure as a crop input.

Presented by Advanced Drainage Systems

00:00 We're talking about manure. We're talking about manure as he crop input. We're talking about animal livestock product that we used 00:06 to frankly treat like crap and we have learned if you treat a little bit better it treats you better. Welcome to extreme AGS cutting 00:15 the curved podcast where you get a guaranteed return on investment of your time as we cut your learning curve with the information. You can apply to your farming operation 00:24 immediately extreme AG, we've already made the mistakes so you don't have to managing. Your Farm's Water Resources is a 00:33 critical component to a successful and sustainable farming operation Advanced Drainage Systems 00:39 helps Farmers, just like you increase their yields up to 30% with their technologically advanced Water Management products visit ads 00:48 to see how they can keep your business flowing. Now, here's your host Damien Mason. Hey there welcome to another fantastic episode 00:58 of extreme acts cutting the curve, it's me Damien Mason. Now with a great guest you're gonna learn a lot from his name 01:04 is Dave coltenberg. He's the director of Midwest sales and the sales director globally for a product called Triune with 01:10 elevated fertility prices even issues of availability now heading into 2023 Mississippi River being dry bars traffic 01:19 halted potential rail strike. Maybe you can't even get your hands on the fertilizer. You need it makes manure all that much more valuable and I want 01:28 to talk about all things manure as a crop input today with Dave coltenberg. Welcome my friend for being 01:34 here and I appreciate you sharing your knowledge. Thank you for having me. Okay. So at AG PhD, I interviewed Temple roads one of our extreme ad guys and 01:43 Brian who is with your company and he referenced somebody within the company that was taken the right way the s*** specialist and 01:52 that was you so now imagine the great honor of being able to have you on here. You're the first s*** specialist 01:58 we've ever had on extreme acts cutting the curve. Um, did we used to treat our manure like crap and now we finally are starting to realize as a crop input 02:07 regenerative AG all these kinds of things organic matter soil Health. It's like wow, we really need to use this stuff better. 02:16 Oh no problem with the manure and any waste products is that everybody considers them as truly a waste or hazardous material and and 02:25 so forth. It's got a lot of issues with it. It's stinks. It's you know got a lot of organisms in it can have traces of 02:34 disinfectants as well. But yes, we we basically looked at manures something that could really go away and not be 02:43 utilized on the farm and guys are finally seeing that manure has a lot of advantages in the fields to the crops and so forth. 02:52 Yeah, it was always something to get rid of and now we're saying wait a minute. Yeah. We do have to get rid of it from 03:01 the livestock facilities, but a bunch of the people that are extreme AG followers aren't really live stock people. They're crop 03:07 real crop people and they're now saying hey, can I get my hands on some of that so Now we are starting to realize it's value. Yes. Yes, the interesting 03:16 part. Is that a lot of the dairies and everybody that has excessive amount of manure, but I don't know a farmer that will ever turn 03:25 down a free manure application on their fields or anything like that. We've gone from it being free to now actually a commodity that farmers can 03:34 actually sell or and so forth for the nutrients. I know a lot of large dairies will swap manure as a fertilizer substitute to commercial fertilizers 03:43 and quite honestly, it's it's much better for the soils and Commercial fertilizer is as far as salts and in other avenues of 03:52 and mineralization and everything in the soil. Yeah, that's a that's one of the reasons. I rent my Farmland to a large scale Dairy operation and 04:01 one of the reasons I went with them was I want that Alfalfa because it's good for the ground and we had a little bit of a erosion issues 04:07 on a couple of the Acres. But also I wanted that manure tell me what we know now that we didn't know 20 years ago or 30 years ago or 50 04:16 years ago or even 10 years ago about manure now all manure is not created equal hog. Chicken Dairy, whatever just some things that you see now or that are in 04:25 the discussion now that weren't as it relates to soil and soil health. 04:30 Well, the interesting part is that when we put manure out there. Yes, in 50 40 04:36 30 years ago. We didn't consider it as a real viable product. We saw it more as a haste or a waste and in an issue 04:45 to get rid of it, but the interesting part is now we've done the research on it that we know what it's nutrients are. We know that the nutrients are, 04:54 you know, like a nitrogen you got ammonium ammonia nitrates and nitrates. We now know what those 05:00 all do in our soils. We have figured out products to actually help protect the ammonium in the soil, 05:09 like what triangle can do for you and will do for you we deal with manure as you know, you got a lot of work to break up the 05:18 crust the salads so forth but the biology and the soils is very very interesting because we're going towards soil Health. Okay, so 05:27 when you use a chemical that Kills the bacterias or the enzymes and the soils you're disrupting that whole process in the 05:36 soils. As far as how things are broke down and go from one stage of nitrogen like ammonium to ammonia. You got the irrigation inhibitor the urea 05:46 enzyme that breaks it down. Anyway, wait, you're good. You're getting a little agronomic there buddy the Urias. What is 05:52 like some sort of word from like the last Star Wars Trilogy I watched what are you talking about? Well, when you look at nitrogen what breaks it down in the soils, 06:01 you get the organic matter and that releases your organic North nitrogen when it goes in you got ammonium, which 06:07 is nh4. Okay. Now we take it from nh4 to H3, which is ammonia gas. Okay, well in the soils that volatilizes off 06:16 the manure and you're losing nitrogen now we can actually do is we know that you're Ace is the enzyme that breaks that down and then you 06:25 go into the night just an almost the night just Factor enzymes and they break down your nitrogens into the nitrates. 06:30 Nitrates so we know so much more today than we did. 10 years ago or you know way back when when my family had cattle it 06:41 dairy cattle. We had Hogs we had beef and and everything and we always considered that the worst jobs and 06:47 and everything but that's actually Black Gold there the research out there shows that when we use manure on the fields, we get a lot better crop. We 06:56 have the organic matter that breaks down over time and also helps spoon feeds that crop now commercial fertilizer you put 07:05 out there basically urea or Maps Etc. You're different nutrients have to mineralize and then it's in the soils. Will there's no 07:14 regulating product out there that helps control that break down in the soils. So now a product 07:21 Like Triune actually goes in there and helps protect that nitrogen and also protects phosphates. We have a big issue with phosphates in our soils because 07:30 it constantly accumulates. Well when phosphate accumulates in the soils, you got high calcium magnesium aluminum and 07:36 ions back in the day waist treatment facilities would treat their their waste with an Alum or aluminum product or an iron 07:45 product that binds to phosphate. Well what happens is it also thinks it out of suspension, but once it's locked up only mother nature release it out there 07:54 now, we have products that instead of building up our phosphates and in any phosphate you put out there you only get about 20% uptake in the 08:03 plant what happens is is that we now can can convert that from 20% to upwards of 60% or 70 percent and 08:12 really increase yields and size of the plants Etc. So it's it's interesting how a lot of farms are like, oh I have so much phos 08:21 out there. I don't need any more protection. That's incorrect because it's tied up and only mother nature releases it now on a nitrogen side. We 08:29 have a lot of nitrogen out there. And what happens is is that you take urea which is mostly ammonium nitrogen. 08:38 Well when that ammonium nitrogen breaks down, okay, the microbes and enzymes feed on that and then that converts it now when 08:47 you had a microbial into manure or onto your soils every living organism just like you and I have to eat. Well as you 08:56 do that it converts some of that nitrogen and the the enzymes in the soils will convert that nitrogen so that it forms 09:05 a different form of nitrogen, which is now highly susceptible to leaching or volatilizing up. Now we can protect it in the soils. We 09:14 can protect it in a pits and reduce our odors we can you know have a product that comes in. There is a dispersant and 09:23 helps break up the crust solids pull them up in the bottom now give you a more uniform manure and we know that when you use some 09:32 products out there like try you we increase the nitrogen and then when you take manure samples from beginning to end of the pumping, you 09:41 know, if you take a sample out of the first few loads the middle loads the end loads, we know that the nitrogen and all the elements the nutrients 09:50 are fairly equal instead of before your company. Let's go and get to this one thing. So that's big by the way all the nutrition equal Agro take USA your 09:59 company and we've talked about some of your other stuff a product that the guys had really good success with maybe God bless the name of it the stuff 10:08 neutral charge it helps with phosphorus uptake. But this product called trying you you are obviously globally in 10:18 charge of this product called Triune and I guess if you to come to me five years ago or two years ago and said, hey, we got this stuff that 10:27 makes Miner better. I'm like, oh for god sakes come on, you know, we're just starting to get to where we understand the value of livestock waste as being a valuable byproduct. 10:36 As you said the chicken facilities Midwest poultry 10 miles down the road here used to give Chicken litter away. I mean like Hey, we're in a 10:45 business of making eggs come and get our crap and boom just get out of here. Now, as you said, it's got a lot of value the story 10:51 of what three years ago that not only we start being better about understanding the value of it. Then fertilizer availability 10:58 you commercial fertilizer, you know synthetic if you will availability in price shot through the roof and then it became a big new discussion 11:08 and appreciation about livestock Manor. Is that right about goes begin 11:13 I said is a little bit longer that we can't became more conscientious of what goes in our soils. But but you know, 11:19 the interesting part is yes, they're synthetics, but also, you know, your phosphates are mined and then they're they're combined with some nitrogen and that's 11:28 all through the process a lot of things when you add other things to the process that brings something else to the party. Okay. So like map it's 11:37 nitrogen and phosphate and dap is nature and phosphate. It's not straight phosphate potash is potassium. So there you got potassium is mind. It's actually 11:46 treated with dust control agent sized and shipped out and that's blended into your commercial fertilizers. But remember those are actually minerals. 11:56 So do you have to wait for that to break down and go into soil? So they're minerals like like rocks, you 12:05 know course. Yeah, like like quartz or graphite or whatever that we grab out of the earth. So there's not there's the uptake and the 12:14 fact that it needs to almost degrade a little bit to make it plant available is that we're kind of really talking about very yes. Yes exactly. So so 12:23 we now can take the organic matter which is the salad and manure and when that breaks down from the microbes and enzymes, you'll 12:32 have a product, you know, try you and will be there to help protect that so we don't lock it up in the soils and we protect the nitrogen we reduce 12:41 the gases. It doesn't yes. I know that I started off by talk about when we started realizing the value of manure and that was say five years ago or so that we really 12:50 start understanding and it also coincided with a commercial fertilizer shortage and or price. 12:56 Greece that was like not just five percent. It was hell was up a hundred percent some cases and then there's this product that your company 13:02 agrotech has called Triune and the pitch on that was we make fertilized. We make Miner better. We make manure more available. But you already told me manures already 13:11 more available to the plant than synthetic fertilizers. So why do I need Tryon when manures already more available and is a better more 13:20 shall we say natural source? What's why do I need your stuff? Well, it's it's really simple because yes manure is 13:29 always available. You have to break it down and such but it's kind of like releasing the horse out of the barn. You've got 13:35 to still control that horse or that horse is just gonna you know vanish on you. You'll never get it back and it's it's very true with the nutrients in 13:44 manure as well. You can have the nitrogen there and volatile eyes and everything and it's gone. Now you 13:50 use a product try you actually connects to the ammonium molecule and holds it back in and rains it in for We need it to work. Okay, so the value the 13:59 value isn't it doesn't need degraded the way a synthetic fertilizer. Does it more needs controlled constraint it more needs held 14:08 back is what I'm hearing and trying it keeps this stuff from being. All released all at once 14:16 Well, it's it's true but there's two forms to it one is it protects the nutrients to it's actually dispersant. So 14:25 you need these salads and everything in your storage manure, you know, you have your crust and you have your solids in the bottom and you need to bring those up into suspension in 14:34 order form to continually break down with the microbials that are actually in the manure. Okay. So that's 14:40 when you use, you know, if you use a microbial product, it releases that but you have nothing there to protect it. Now we can do everything from dispersing and 14:49 protection of those nutrients and let nature take its course in the pits. And those are the strongest form microbials and we work hand in 14:58 hand. Now, we also go to the field and we use the Triune will actually protect the nutrients and release to the plant and kind of spoon feed 15:07 it throughout the season and instead of only being there for a very short period of time. I mean try you and last 10 plus months. I'll never do a try on the 15:16 same. Spot year after year because of that issue. Yes. And how do I use this? I know how to use manure either it spreads on solid or 15:25 we pump it, you know over the top or we drag line it. I mean there's all different I got that. How do I use your stuff guy? Because he's put liquid. 15:34 It was put all he wants to pump out his lagoons or his pits and Put liquid Dairy minor on my Fields. How 15:40 do I use your stuff to make that? I'm in her more valuable? We just go out at a rate of 18 to 15:46 24 ounces per acre and go and figure out you know, if you had a million gallons, you're going out at 10,000 gallons per acre. You're looking at a hundred acres. So equate 15:55 that out at 18 times 100 acres, you're gonna need about 14 15 gallons and just pour it in agitate it and go now if you want it 16:04 to help break up the salads and the sentiment on the bottoms you had it in and we can last in the pit and 16:10 let that work. So put it on we're putting it on in the pit or in the lagoon not in the in the application equipment. Oh 16:20 over the top like chicken litter we'd have to put that over the top on dry litter but in liquids we can add it right to the liquid manure and 16:29 let it do its thing. He just pour it in and go so everyone Drive chicken litter I got it on how I can dump it into 16:35 Lagoon. Thank you if I want to and that's probably gonna be for Hogs as well because they're usually raised over pits and lagoons. Dry chicken 16:41 litter. How do I put it on dry? Chicken letter, if I just go out there 24 ounces and start fling it around ain't gonna touch the stuff. So do I mix it in 16:49 some sort of a slightly you gotta add it to water the more carrier of water the better. It'd be we're doing 16:55 trials with that as we speak. So that's where that's at for right now, but recommended at 18 to 24 ounces per acre or 17:04 you add it into say 40 gallons of water and then spray that over the top and the litter of the literally of the 17:13 litter litter spread as you can you can land spread it and then come with a rogator or an applicator or some sort and spray over 17:22 the top and it'll create a layer and other words put the litter on then go across the field again and spray it versus just trying to spray it on the chicken manure yourself. 17:31 Yeah, we're doing we're doing testing right now where we can actually spray it as the litter comes across down to conveyor belt and see if we can get enough application to 17:41 it. Sure. That's a little bit trouble. It harder because you're at you know, say four inches. How do you get it into the center? And that's the issue 17:49 because the chicken there's always a pile so sudden I get the the outside of it really well covered but then down the bottom nothing's happening. That's gonna be that's a bit of an ongoing formula. 17:58 Let's talk about Miner again. It's a crop in but You know, it's not like the it's not like ten years ago. We were taking hog or dairy or 18:07 beef feed yard manure or chicken litter and just going out and dumping the ocean. We've always thrown it out on fields. So it's not as though we 18:16 weren't using it. But it seems like we're understanding the value of it more now. Are we getting more bang for our buck than we did 10 years 18:24 ago. I mean, it's still got put out there the dairy Farmhouse raised on and as usual the stuff that's within. 18:31 A spreader length of the Barns and was the stuff that got hit a lot the stuff that never got me there on it was the stuff that was too far away. 18:40 I mean that's that's the way every one of these Midwest dairy farm and you know is like, yeah, wherever you're close to the close 18:46 to the facility got all the miner. We didn't miss we didn't we didn't unapply it. It's just that we're maybe weren't getting 18:54 our bang for our buck. Am I right? Well, yes, um, like today I have a lot of guys that say that my nutrient value of 19:02 their manure is higher. So now I can afford to ship it farther away from the field so I can go six ten miles now because now I'm putting 19:11 on a higher rate of nutrients per thousand gallons then before you're right that manure constantly 19:20 volatilizes off the nitrogen. Okay, if we spray nitrogen on the surface of the field, we'll lose 50% of that nitrogen in 19:29 48 hours because In the Heat of the summer or fall again, if we go out there and put on what kind of product are we put on what kind of okay if if we 19:38 took liquid manure and put it on the surface, we'll lose 50% and 48 Hours of our nitrogen. Okay. That's why we've now gone to incorporating it 19:47 and that's still a very good. that's that's the best thing we have right now is incorporating it, but the problem is 19:56 it's still not protected. So the enzymes and everything and the microbials in the soils are still going to go after it as a protein Source because that's what nitrogen is a protein source. 20:06 and then when it does that it's going to break down involves lives. So you got to now protected in the soil and go 20:14 from there. And even ethanol plant. First a person is listening is this in the Cranberry businesses incorporating it. What 20:20 do you talk about going to the attorney and setting up an LC? No incorporating it means cultivating it in so that I don't have 20:26 the volatilization of the what there is and also you get rid of the smell. Yeah. Well the flip side is that cranberry farmers will not be using manure out 20:35 in their fields. I used to work with cranberries in Wisconsin and and everything like that. They just go commercial fertilizers 20:41 and they actually spread about a hundred pounds to the acre every week. So they spoon feed that crop that way that's 20:47 one way to do it. But the problem is is that when we put manure out there we only have two times to put it out there spring and fall okay, or when the crop it's gone in 20:56 the summer, but the interesting part is if we can put it in in earlier in the fall and not have to wait to the soils get below 50 degrees when all 21:05 microbials go dormant or Life then we have to look at what can we do to help spread out our timing of 21:15 application? So when we spread out our timing of application to an earlier fall say August September, then we can now protect that 21:24 nutrient and not lose it. Okay. Everybody knows if we apply manure right for a crop. That's the best thing right time right place and right application 21:33 all okay I get that but now this helps you extend your manure application so that we're not out there and having to spread 80 million gallons in 21:42 one week. Okay, that's not feasible. And now we can start doing this and increasing our application time over 21:51 months versus days before and incorporating it in and mix it in with knife again in and and mixing in the soils. That's 22:00 great because then it's going to absorb up into the soils. It's going to use the CD. CC's the cation exchange and connect 22:10 to that ammonium molecule. Well now with our polymers the Triune and and other polymers we can actually do that in the pit. And 22:19 that's how we protect the nitrogen from volatilizing and we protect it from the greenhouse gases, which everybody is 22:25 concerned about and that's the buzzword now is greenhouse gases. How do we protect it and reduce that emissions and everything like that? Okay in 22:34 Europe, that's the deal. The Netherlands is very foolishly letting environmental extremism shut down farms and they're going doing under the guise of greenhouse 22:44 gases and nitrogen nitrous oxide nitrate nitrate. It's the big buzzword. I mean manure and nitrogen over there an animal Lee animal livestock or under pretty vicious 22:53 attack. There's something like your product. Can we make the argument and scientifically back it up that it decreases greenhouse gas 23:03 emissions by using a product like yours. Is that is that one of the benefits? That's that's very fair to say because I 23:09 got that guys with digesters and we're talking guys with 5,000 cows plus that they're like, well, can I put it through my digest and wait for a person that has no 23:18 idea we're talking about they are in Western Oklahoma, like what the hell's he talking about digest or explain 23:24 what that is, please Dairy digester is actually a way to extract the gases particularly methane so that it can run a generator and 23:33 create some electricity and everything like that, you know put on large-scale Dairy operations because they have a amazing amount of value of 23:42 liquid manure. Is that right? Correct? And when you have to have about 4,000 calories to get a digester and actually pay for itself, but there's a 23:51 tremendous amount of Maintenance to them. There's a tremendous amount of build up of minerals. Just like in your faucets you 23:57 Have that white stuff, which is calcium. And that's from the hard Waters and things like that. Now just the digester of a nurse liquid murder goes in there. It goes 24:06 through digestion. It takes methane out. That's then used as gas to power. 24:11 Power stuff and also breaks down the manure to be more useful for your crop input. Correct? Yes, but 24:17 it's but it's kind of like like the difference between using a Ortho product which is readily available versus your traditional 1034 O's 24:26 and things like that. So the digesters accelerate that because they want to produce as much methane as possible. Now, you also have hydrogen sulfide 24:35 as well. You have ammonia gas as well. But what Triune can actually do is go in there and protect the ammonium and when you have 24:44 a reduction of ammonium, you have a reduction of hydrogen sulfide and methane. Like I said before some of my digesters that 24:50 do that process if they send try unit. The full rate will actually reduce the production of methane and everything. So in the inside 24:59 the digester which then is not which is not good because they want the method, correct, correct, correct. So what we 25:05 do is a lot of my customers will do is put her to after the digester because they Have the extract the 25:13 solids and then they still have to land spread. Well, some of my digesters just have the solids go right into the lagoons and the next thing you know, they're building up a tremendous volume 25:22 in there, you know, if you look at a digester and they have a 3% salads over 10 10 years, you've lost 30% of your Lagoon capacities 25:31 and the guys that are actually letting our solids go in after they're separated and go right back into Lagoon and then mix it with the liquid Etc 25:40 will now you're losing more because it all settles up in the bottoms or creates a tremendous crust. And what try you does is 25:49 helps breaks that all part pulls it back up just a suspension and go from there. So even the manure coming out of a digester is completely different in 25:58 nutrients versus what we use from just straight lagoons or before it goes to the digester. Your nitrogen is in a 26:07 different form. You're at higher concentrations of the more ammonium. 26:10 Trades because it breaks down inside these digesters and so forth. So the best part is is that 26:16 Triune can work in all scenarios. Yeah. Answer me this and for the person that's this is all kind of foreign to them and and like okay 26:26 this kind of cool, you know, obviously we'll talk about NPK and PK. 26:30 There's essentially manure is nitrogen and phosphorus. There's essentially no K in manure. Am I right? 26:37 No, there is there's there's potassium in there. So yes k k is in there but c k and that's if I look at it just about any manure. It's gonna be 26:46 heavy on the pee low on the K in terms of what you get. What are your extracting from? And then depending on the type manner heavier on nitrogen? Just help me out here. I want to I'm trying 26:55 to get this all straight because you're the I'm not the agronomist. Like chicken manure is heavy on nitrogen 27:01 and obviously got the phosphorus but what there's generally low amounts of potassium on a comparative basis. Am I right? 27:10 Correct. Yes walk me through the different manures and what that what in general they look like. Yeah more nitrogen and 27:16 dairy and more nitrogen and chicken. Yes. Yes. Your chicken is probably one of your highest in for nitrogens. So is 27:25 make I work with guys that have 600,000 make and that has to go somewhere. So there's a whole bunch of people are saying what in the hell is he talking about? This 27:34 is the extreme AG cutting the curb podcast. He's talking about mink Farms. It's a real thing the fur generally goes overseas because 27:40 they still wear fur coats and other countries. We just not deemed to be cruel here and don't they feed them like a slurry 27:46 of of byproducts from chicken processing facilities or something? Well, there's some of that but but interesting enough, they get fed a lot 27:55 of vegetables corn and carrots and things like that as well. So it's a very balanced diet and so forth. 28:01 So, you know, it's it's yes, we work with all things in English you're catching me there and then it's heavy. 28:09 Lot, did you say it's higher and what it's high in nitrogen and phosphate? Yeah, as most manures are hogmanner. Not as 28:18 much nitrogen as a dairy or a chicken, right? No, actually you go chicken and then down to 28:24 hog manure is high and nitrogens and then Dairy because you look at it, you know, you're putting on somewhere around two maybe three thousand pounds of chicken litter per 28:33 acre Hogs, you're generally in that three to six range and depending on where it comes out of it comes out of the nurseries versus 28:43 the cell units versus the finishers and then you get your dairies because we usually apply some around 8 to 10 to 15,000 depending on how much 28:52 liquid is going in there and these outside the goons because the water will dilute it down and then you got to put more gallons on 28:58 per acre. So that's the beautiful part about you and it works in all situations at 18 to 24 ounces per acre doesn't matter. We're 29:07 going to concentration of nutrients. So the reason I brought up the inn and the Pea in the gay is that it varies a little bit by the product obviously from the practice and 29:15 the you know, everything from minks to dairies, whatever. There we're doing a better job analysis, right? So if you're gonna 29:22 go out and work with somebody, do you tell them? Hey pull some tests. And so we know what is in your manure before we just start 29:28 Willie Nelly toss the stuff around. Well, that's that's mandated. When you you start doing your manure applications and your and kfos and 29:36 everything like that. That's mandated that they gotta pull samples state of Iowa. They have pull samples and they 29:42 usually go in and pull multiple samples in and send that in so that they know what their nutrient values are so that they don't over apply. So 29:51 yes we do in and we know that historically will have you know, 20 years of data there and we'll look at the last 10 and 30:00 then do an average and we see constantly that one the trium manure is a lot more uniform and is actually increased in nutrients because 30:09 the phosphate like we said is always there it's not gonna ball it's lies and it usually goes down on the bottom. So when you get to the end of the pit or Lagoon, that's where all 30:18 your goodies are is that it's the thick Rich manure and that's what a lot of the phosphate sulfurs and and potassium are 30:25 Um, so we now can bring that up into suspension and get a lot more uniform manure out there. So moving forward. Are we 30:34 going to be even better five years from now at getting more extraction of value from our manure as we were I mean because we've come 30:43 a long way. We're getting more out of it now. It seems to me are we gonna be better at five years from now than we are right now? Oh absolutely. 30:50 Absolutely. We will be in five years. It's ever changing every every process is changing everything that we're adding into 30:59 manures that sort of thing, you know, like up in Canada. They use a lot of because they have a high concentration of bacteria in your 31:08 Waters and everything. Well that kills off a lot of the microbials and manure and that sort of thing. So there's all 31:14 kinds of things that factor in the manure. So yes, we're gonna be, you know, increasing the value of 31:20 the manure we're gonna be wasting less nutrients less runoff less nitrates. 31:25 Water in the tape ground Waters and Etc. We're getting more and more efficient because why lose it when you can use it and that's what 31:34 I always go by is that we need to protect those nutrients to work for us before. We're like, like you said usually 31:43 around the fields around the barn get the most nutrients and because well, it's raining I can't go very far. Okay. Now we got 31:52 such, you know, uniformity and things like that and we're increasing the value of what is there. 31:58 So that we cannot afford to ship it farther and get more bang for our buck out of this manure. 32:04 I sat on a session years ago and I remember I never forgot it was some of these was supposed to be a high yield guy and talking about soils and he said it's impossible to 32:13 increase organic matter. In our soils in our lifetime and at that very moment. I said that that can't be accurate that can't be accurate because I 32:20 can look at organic matter in areas where manure got put to it over years versus areas that did not and there's a tremendous difference. First off 32:29 you I guess you'd agree that that was in an accurate statement, right? Yes, because every time we're actually applying manure or you're tilling in the 32:38 crop residue you're increasing your organic matter right there. So, you know, that's the thing 32:44 is depending on what product you use different products work differently some actually go in and break down your organic matter and field. Well 32:53 that's gonna be a little bit tougher because it breaks down to nutrients and you have a possibility of them you running 32:59 off the fields so forth. But yeah, you can increase your your value of your organic matter or field absolutely so I'm 33:08 gonna rapid fire here because we're getting ready to wrap up. So when I think about miners value it helps us increase organic matter. Into the crop residue and all that stuff. It helps us increase organic matter 33:18 improve soil biology. Yes, whatever time that manure hurts so biology, I don't think there is a Only when you put too much you get too much of a good thing out there 33:27 and that's why we do the testing. Yeah, I mean you can't over apply manure and I just it's not just that example I gave for 50 years. We went up behind a bar 33:36 and applied it. That's still that's not over applying. It's just going all the same place you're talking about when you're just dousing it 33:42 with too much quantity in a rapid amount of time. Yes, you put too much nitrogen out there, you know, when you put ammonium nitrogen and everything out 33:51 there you burn the roots and it'll actually hinder your yields. If you use a product that actually locks up your phosphates in the manure and what 34:00 it'll do is actually create high phosphates that you can't use anything nothing's already available to the crop. So that's another issue. If you use like an aluminum product 34:09 waist treatment facilities use Aluminum Products and next thing, you know, they're high toxic soils and they don't grow anything. So you gotta be careful what you put in there to 34:18 you get to remember is that you gotta look at the big picture not just a slice of the pie. Yeah, last thought for me on manure 34:28 utilization and where we are as a crop input for our listeners anything that you want to wrap up with it. We didn't cover. Well, you know we need to get smarter about manure applications 34:41 and we need to look at products and we need to look at products and test them on your own fields and not always take what people 34:50 say is gospel because there's a lot of products out there that are very good but they don't necessarily do what they say. Every time I 34:59 I go out there people like if it did half of what you say, it'll be tremendous next thing, you know, they're calling me up after I say well just 35:05 try it in one bar. Yeah, you're right, you know we never did we never dump stuff into our manner in the 35:11 old days. So this is this is a new territory. I mean, it's kind of like Biologicals 20 years ago at snake oil 35:17 10 years ago, you didn't dump stuff you didn't dump stuff into your manure so I can see where there's some skepticism. And so to 35:23 the person that's questioning the value of manure additives you would say Well, yes, you're right the the 35:33 old practices of a biological microbial product. They're there to help you break down a solids, but you got nothing there to 35:39 protect your nutrients and that's what it's all about is that we have to look at what nutrients do in the soils how to protect those 35:45 nutrients for the crop and that we don't create another issue like groundwater contamination and things like that. So we 35:51 have to look at microbials go dormant below 50 with look at products that are gonna work year round and Longevity. So that's where 36:00 we're heading is you thought I was talking about biological manner treatments. I just meant that 20 years ago biological sprayed over 36:09 the top of a soybean field. We thought was a crazy idea and now we're realizing that it actually there's a lot of them and they're and that's 36:15 what we're doing a lot of trials with them. I was not talking about that now, that's the last question for you and Agro Tech USA's product 36:21 called try you it's a microbial. Is that what I'm now, you know, it's not microbial. What is it? It's completely 36:30 Different chemistry and it's considered a polymer and the only reason it's called a polymer is how the molecules are lined up kind of like the two by fours in your 36:39 walls of your house. They're lined up parallel to each other and that's the only reason it's called a polymer and it's not a living 36:45 organism. It actually has a negative charge and connects to the nitrogen molecule in the manure. Okay, just like what your cecs do 36:54 in the soils is that they combine to the nitrogen molecule ammonium and we can now do that in the manure and have it safe. So 37:03 we're water soluble and and biodegradable so we don't leave an environmental footprint. Okay, so that's the beautiful part is when these organic 37:14 The organic material in the soils break down and release that nitrogen we could be there to connect it to preserve it for the crop understood. Okay, 37:23 understood. I just want to find out the the chemistry behind it. So it's a pump. All right. This is my last this 37:29 last question. Your name's Dave kaltenberg you're with agrotech USA and you're the director of Midwest 37:35 sales and you're the global director sales for us product called trying that we've been talking a lot about but here's the big question for you. 37:42 You are Wisconsin guy. I'm in Indiana guy. We're both from a livestock raising background and you call it maure Ma hyphen n 37:51 e w like new not old. ER newer I call it manure and I was wondering what people like you that I've people correct me. I say no, it's manure you call it manure 38:03 I said, oh really? So if it's p u r e is it pure and if it's if it's s u r e like I'm certain of it. Is it sewer? No, it's sure manure. 38:17 Help me out here. Are you wrong or am I? Well, I would say we're both right now. The only thing I will say is that when you look at newscasters around 38:26 the world a lot of them come from the mid Upper Midwest versus Indiana because we are more exact 38:32 on our pronunciations really. So now you're bashing on my regionality, huh? And you know what words manure here's the deal Dave the 38:40 words manner is not manure and you Wisconsin people don't know you're talking about screw the Packers there. I just said it. All right, his name's Dave coltonberg. He's 38:49 a director of Midwest sales and training for agrotechusa. If you want to learn more about this product called try you or more about manure manure. 38:55 Here's the deal. We're gonna have another episode where we break down the data. We're actually going to do the analytics of the fertility available and 39:04 returns, etc. Etc. When we get this and it's gonna be pretty fascinating stuff. So I might have Dave back on along with somebody else from agrotech when we have pure number 39:13 data that you can then look at and say, oh gosh, am I getting the most out of my manure? So anyway Dave they will find out more where they 39:22 go. Agrotech and we have a website you can ask questions and we'll get back in touch with you and go from there Agro Tech 39:32 just like it sounds Agro Tech and you know, I am from Indiana. I'm not a newscaster from the Upper Midwest and I can say Agro Tech 39:41 the words manner not manure. Thank you Dave for being here. Thank you. Until next time is Extreme ax cutting occur. That's a wrap 39:50 for this episode of cutting the curve, but there's plenty more check out where 39:56 you can find past episodes instructional videos and articles to help you squeeze more profit out 40:02 of your farm cutting. The curve is brought to you by Advanced Drainage Systems the leader in agriculture Water Management Solutions.