Are We Paying Farmers for the Wrong Thing? | The Granary

00:00:00 Should farmers be paid for the nutrient content of the crop they produce? That's the topic we're talking about here 00:00:05 with my friends at the Grainery. You ready for a Conversation with some real farmers about real issues? And the best part, you are invited. 00:00:13 Pour yourself a drink, grab a snack. Most importantly, pull Up a chair. 00:00:19 Welcome to the Grainery. Hey Guys. Alright guys, there's the topic. Should farmers be paid for the nutrient content 00:00:33 of the crop you produce? It's like, wait a minute. You mean they don't a lot of people outside agriculture? No. We sell pounds, we sell bushels. 00:00:40 We sell 56 pounds of number two yellow corn. What's in it? Nobody's ever cared. You think it's gonna change? 00:00:48 I I do think it's gonna change. I think the sustainable space where now we're, we're being paid in some instances for carbon sequestration, 00:00:56 insets, or offsets, whatever program you're in, I believe that that's going to evolve into nutrient density 00:01:02 for quality of food. You think that's gonna where you and I both think it's where it's gonna go? Yeah. Because we've got production mastered. 00:01:09 We can make massive quantities, piles in fact of corn, soy, wheat, whatever. But almost no program actually gives compensation 00:01:18 to the producer for what is in the content of the crop they produce. Yeah. Since, I mean since we're compensated for volume, 00:01:27 we grow carbohydrates, we grow calories, and I mean, at the end of the day, that's kind of probably contributing to the overall health, 00:01:36 health costs of this country. And I think, you know, to Kelly's point, I think we will evolve to, uh, 00:01:42 grow more nutritious food. But the challenge is still going to be how do we get the consumer to recognize that? 00:01:51 How does, how do they walk through the supermarket and see something that's more nutrient dense? And then how do they realize the consequences of that? 00:02:01 And maybe fewer trips to the doctor and things like that. Where's the point, where's the money gonna come from? 00:02:06 Okay. It's funny that he says that, but thing about how we grow crops, you know, you know that food is medicine. 00:02:12 Right. You know, I mean, Kelly and I talked about this before, but you know, think about you, you start to think about that. 00:02:18 It's very similar the way that we grow our crops. We know, we know that we don't necessarily need to use fungicide, you know, to to, to fix a crop, right. 00:02:29 If the nutrients are right going into it, they fight it themselves. Yeah. It's the same thing. It's just down the line. 00:02:36 It's the, it's the exact same thing, but how do we get paid for that? Now there is some instances where, um, let's just say for, 00:02:43 for us, where I am, where, you know, for wheat alone, we sell to a flower mill and it is mill quality wheat. If it's not mill quality wheat to consider it feed wheat 00:02:55 and feed wheat doesn't, you know, you don't get paid for that as much. 00:03:00 If you can keep a really great crop and you can keep it a nutrient dense crop and it's, it doesn't have all of the diseases in it and it, 00:03:10 and it doesn't have ba toxin in it. Yeah. All these things, you know, over the last, I don't know, let's call it 10 years 00:03:17 that we've gotten better at growing a crop. We have not had vomit toxin in our wheat. And I've had phone calls back from, you know, the mill 00:03:27 or the, my broker and they're like, why is your wheat not getting turned down? I don't understand why your wheat's not getting turned down. 00:03:33 There's other ones that I'm buying, I'm buying wheat in the area and they're getting turned down. 00:03:38 We are all treating it the exact same. But the difference is, is the nutrients we've paid attention. 00:03:44 Mm-hmm. Putting the nutrients in and, and what's coming out and the, and Therefore kept the parasite out or kept the disease out. 00:03:49 Right. It kept the disease out. So, I mean, I, I think that it's The same concept for you. It's 00:03:52 the same concept. Keep the nutrients right in us and keeps it Exactly what I'm wondering. Um, you know, we're gonna, 00:03:58 first off, there's the need for it. Galen talks about the health. There's the practicality of it. 00:04:03 You're going to, with wheat that's gonna get turned down. There's the other part of it though, 00:04:07 that a lot of people haven't really considered. I mean, we got all kinds of people watching this show and they're saying, well, how would that work? 00:04:14 It kind of flies in the face of what the last 100 years of the commodity markets have tried to create. What they tried to create, what what they effectively 00:04:22 and very, very effectively and successively did create, was a commodity product that you knew exactly what you were getting. 00:04:30 You were getting 56 pound number two yellow corn, and nobody ever said, what's the protein? What's the carbohydrate? What's the, this content, whatever 00:04:38 we're talking about changing that. Well, that's gonna be pretty hard to go to the c and e group and tell 'em, well, we're gonna change up how you do things. 00:04:45 I agree. That is very hard to change. Uh, but what we're talking about isn't a commodity market. It is more of a specialized market. 00:04:52 Uh, wheat is, uh, just about the only thing, uh, from a grain standpoint that I can think of. 'cause you're paid on quality, you're paid 00:04:59 on protein, things like that. You know, if you take it into a livestock market, uh, the cattle that we talk about, you know, you the grade 00:05:06 of the cattle, things like that. And so there are some examples now on a cash basis, but not on the board of trade. 00:05:12 We is really, you say you don't get a bonus, you get a ding. Yeah. Well if we ha if we meet certain quality standards, 00:05:19 Protein 13% protein or something, you Know, we can get, well, you can get a protein premium, but it sure isn't as bad as the protein deduction. 00:05:27 That's Exactly right. And, and that will probably, probably what happens to, in my opinion, is 00:05:32 that the nutrient density that we need to hit. Yeah. That becomes a commodity market. And there are deductions. Yeah. 00:05:37 I don't know that we're talking about premiums. We're talking about deductions. If you don't meet Their dem Yeah, it's demerit. 00:05:42 If you don't have the wheat is not of this and it's not. And, and people probably are going mistaken, Galen, you can, 00:05:49 we're not saying what you produce is low quality. We're not insulting anybody. It's just that it's never, 00:05:54 you've never been rewarded financially for taking in something that's like my wheat's at 16% protein. 00:06:01 If you can do such a thing, you've never been rewarded for that. You haven't been rewarded for it 00:06:05 because number one, the, you know, sort of keeping it identity per preserved, you know, at any one location is difficult. 00:06:12 I mean, if I were to actually haul a load of 17% protein, wheat to my local elevator is going in 00:06:18 with a 10% protein wheat, and then it's lost its value right there. And so yeah. How do we, you know, how do you monetize it? 00:06:27 How do we follow that and track that through the system? And to Kelly's point from earlier, it's going 00:06:33 to be incumbent on us to somehow prove to the consumer that we are producing more nutrient rich food for them. You think the demand comes from the consumer, 00:06:44 the person in suburban America that says, I want something to be better. I think it's gotta be somewhere in between. 00:06:49 Because the disconnect you live next in Baltimore, there's a million and a half people there, whatever, 00:06:56 they don't come out and buy wheated from you. Yeah. They buy wheat via bread, which came from here. You know, there's so many levels in between. I don't know. 00:07:03 The consumer might demand it, but right now the consumer can't buy it. Well, you know, one of the amazing parts to me is, 00:07:09 is when you look at, um, you know, the way that Kelly and I farm, you know, which what I would call us regenerative farm, everything 00:07:17 that we do, you know, we're keeping the green root in the ground. You know, the, just the way that we do 00:07:21 things is very different. We were forced to do it. But then you have organic farmers out there, and I'm not knocking organic farming. 00:07:27 They have figured out a way to monetize it and it's worked very well for 'em. But the nutrients that is in organic, um, 00:07:35 corn is very different than the nutrients in a crop that Kelly and I are raising very, very different. And they're paying a premium for a product 00:07:45 that is less nutrient rich than what our product is. So, but their, but their claim is, is that, you know, 00:07:51 hey look, it's organic. Yeah. This is what you're paying for and it's actually worse for 00:07:56 That. I mean, that, that's the part that we've gotta marry up because it's all these perceptions that, oh my gosh, organic 00:08:03 that has had no fertilizer. Yeah. Right. Applied to it or, or only organic fertilizers better. 00:08:10 And really you can get more nutrient deficient food coming off of that, the Consumer might say. 00:08:16 And, and we're hearing more about it right now while we're recording this. RFK Junior is possibly gonna be confirmed of new health 00:08:21 and human services secretary, and he's all about, he's, he said the word nutrient density. And that's something a lot of folks Haven said. 00:08:29 Um, but he's also an organic ze and he's got some other warts. But this is coming, I think you think it's coming. 00:08:37 I think it's coming. Just like you saw the sustainable, uh, market has been here now. And you, you know, you can go into marketing groups 00:08:43 and you can see the consumer wants to buy sustainable food. Uh, that, you know, the difference is 00:08:49 that there's nothing wrong with organic, but organic and regenerative or organic and sustainable are two very different things. 00:08:54 Mm. Organic and nutrient dense are two different very things. Yeah. The commodity market we have now is very 00:08:59 different than nutrient dense. I personally believe that, you know, when you talk about food is health, food is medicine, 00:09:05 nutrient density is how we succeed at that. And I believe it's coming just as the other one's coming. I, I used to think that we were gonna have a carbon 00:09:12 intensity score, a CI score on everything we ate and everything we wore, because that was gonna be the metric 00:09:18 that the consumer could make their choice. Now I think there'll be some sort of a nutrient dense score. I don't know exactly what it will be, 00:09:24 but that's how the consumer will make the choice. The consumer isn't buying temple's wheat, but temple's wheat gets segregated. 00:09:30 My wheat at times that my processors have gotten segregated because of the protein content, it gets, um, co-mingled 00:09:38 with wheat of lesser protein. Yeah. They bring it up to a mixed average. Yes. Because then because the end, the end processor, 00:09:44 the end user wants a certain level of protein. Yeah. So they, They're using yours to bring up the s****y stuff. 00:09:49 Yes, yes, they do. They do at times. But let's say we can get there. How, how does the consumer have the assurance? 00:09:56 This is where it's hard because Kelly, you, you're very conscientious about how you fertilize your pasture. 00:10:02 So let's say you produce grass fed beef, which a consumer would like, as long as that pasture's well fertilized, 00:10:09 that is healthy beef for him. But what if your neighbor sells grass fed beef and he never applies any fertilizer. 00:10:18 His, his product is not as nutrient dense. It sounds good at the supermarket. Grass fed beef one's actually good one isn't. 00:10:25 How are we going to, you know, ensure that that doesn't happen? Because we, uh, you know what, well, 00:10:30 in my case would be a little bit different with the meat store GLC beef, we're actually going to send off ribeyes 00:10:36 and hamburger to two different labs that already are conducting these studies. Yeah. And, and we'll have to see what comes back. 00:10:43 But for that to happen in mass across the whole country, it's a huge thing. So, you know that that actually is going, I didn't mean 00:10:49 to cut you off, Damien, but that, you know, you take that into consideration. You know, what you're putting into your beef 00:10:54 and how it's eaten and how you're fertilizer and how you're taking care of your soil. It's, you gotta take it all the way back to the soil. Right. 00:11:01 Because, and, and I, again, I hate to bash on the, on the organic soil guy, but if he's out there working up the ground 00:11:09 and every time he works up the ground, it's that great smell. You know, a man that smells wild, dirt smells great, 00:11:14 but what you're smelling is the carbon being released that's being released. So you're losing all that. So it's actually not healthy soil 00:11:21 over years and years time. If you don't believe me, Google the Dust Bowl. Yeah, yeah. Like, you know what I mean? Like it's not healthy 00:11:27 for, for a long time. Regenerative agriculture is, take that all the way back to when you have, you know, I'm gonna go down a hunting road. 00:11:35 So in our area, I can literally take you to our highest production farms that we've done the best job with, and they will kill monster white-tailed deer on it 00:11:45 with humongous racks. And you can go two farms away from that where it hasn't been treated the same. 00:11:52 And they will never kill a good size racked buckle on that farm. You can take it right back to the soil. 00:11:58 It's the exact same thing when you're talking about grass fed beef. The quality is different on that farm versus Kelly's farm. 00:12:04 And the way that you feed it from the corn to the beans to the grass pasture, it's all part of a big circle. And it's all gonna come right down to the consumer. 00:12:12 But how do you monetize it? Well, if RFK brings forward what he wants to bring forward, it might start there. 00:12:19 And it's also starting the consumer, uh, the consumer. And this is how the sustainable movement started. Things like that. And uh, that's why I think it is coming, 00:12:27 because it's coming from different angles. I Don't think we want it to be regulated. I never want Regulated. 00:12:32 But you don't always, but you don't always have that choice, The market to market. 00:12:37 I don't want it to be regulated either, But you don't listen, regulation is terrible. Don't get me wrong. But regulation also started me on the 00:12:43 path that we got on because it got forced upon us and it forced the way that we lived in the way that we thought down a different path. 00:12:50 It wasn't the wrong thing to do, we just didn't have the technology to do what, to, to do it. It was a very long learning curve. 00:12:57 I guess we should also to, to the viewer regulated should also mean Yeah, regulated means we don't want it to be the Wild West. 00:13:05 And where, where there's, you know, fictitious claims and that kinda problem, but not regulated. Where Galen out in guy in Oklahoma, 00:13:13 if you don't grow this type of a crop, you're, you have to dump it, you know, behind the barn. By the way, I think we forgot to tell the viewer 00:13:20 that we got Galen beer here from Agro Liquid who is sponsoring this episode of The Greenery. And we're so happy to have 00:13:25 them here and we're so happy to have Introduce you halfway through. Uh, I'll take it whenever I get it. 00:13:30 Don't we talk about your, Your professionalism? Whatcha you talking about Frank? Oh, 00:13:34 great. So anyway, we, we really like aggro liquid anyway, so, uh, and, and they're, they're good people. 00:13:40 And, and normally there'd be a sign back there, but, uh, anyway, we, we just had to get into this topic really quickly 00:13:45 because it was, uh, he's gotta catch a plane anyway regulated Yes. To make, uh, make it legal, 00:13:51 but not to make it imposed is probably where it goes. But I think there's only have to be a manufacturer. I, there's have to be a processor that champions this. 00:13:58 I think they a general mills or it wouldn't be them. It'd probably be a niche a a smaller player that starts saying our bread has got twice as much. 00:14:08 I don't know what it even would be to be honest with you, that you would get out of the wheat or whatever. 00:14:12 Right. I think that's worth, you Know, who's doing a really good job, in my opinion, of monetizing this exact, this exact scenario. 00:14:19 Um, I got a good friend of mine in Pennsylvania, Steve Walton Walton Farms, and they have done a really great job 00:14:27 of really picking everything apart. And now, you know, and of course they're chopping all their solids for their big dairy operation. 00:14:34 Mm-hmm. And they've taken it right back to the fact of this nutrient dense crop. The more that they can make a nutrient dense, the more 00:14:41 that they can, the more milk they produce, it's a higher quality milk and they get paid on all those things. 00:14:46 So when it, when something new comes out, you know, um, anything like I'm, I'm talking about anything. I mean, some of the new products that we, that you 00:14:54 and I tested this year, you know, in furrow all these things that he wants to keep the perfect crop all year long 00:15:01 and he pays real close attention to every little thing because it's not about any that he is getting monetized. It's about less, you know, less nutrition has 00:15:10 to go into that cow per day. You know what I mean? Like instead of that cow eating, let's call it 25 pounds a day Yep. 00:15:16 On a regular, um, a regular feed sample. Yeah. He's only paying, you know, let's say he's spent 2 21 to 22 pounds. 00:15:23 Right. He's cut back on feed more nutrient dense. Mm-hmm. Higher quality. The health of the herd is better. 00:15:30 I mean, it is all around a better product and he's got it monetized at the end of the year because he gets paid on milk quality. 00:15:36 Exactly. And it can be reflected in the milk. And I also think the way that he's farming or the way that you and I farm, it's not more expensive. 00:15:42 It isn't about more money for inputs. It's about a reallocation and doing the correct inputs to produce that balance. 00:15:49 She is not producing. He is, he is not putting on more and he has not created his inputs to be way up here. He's just learned what the crop wants 00:15:58 to make it the best possible crop that it can be. Exactly. And it is, and what happens in that, it is not just more yield, 00:16:05 it is a nutrient dense crop period. And, and, and even if, uh, if your beef's coming out of feed yard, if we're more conscientious about 00:16:13 how we feed our corn, great. Put 'em in there, feed 'em the corn. You end up with a great end product 00:16:20 that's nutritious and tastes Good. I'm excited to send the steaks off the hamburger off to see where they come back. 00:16:26 And I've already read the data because they already have several data points and only about 4% 00:16:31 of the beef in the United States is grass fed. I will tell you that the grass fed beef typically scores higher than corn fed beef. 00:16:38 But I believe that's because the grass fed guys do so much better job at looking at their forage and studying what they're doing. 00:16:44 Mm-hmm. And the corn fed guys, our corn typically has been out of balance. Our corn isn't nutrient dense. 00:16:50 Well, we're pushing yield. Exactly. We're just like you talked about earlier, I'm excited to see where does my, 00:16:56 where does my meat score Yep. When I, with my corn. And, and then I wanna see how much better can I do with my corn and be reflected into my beef. 00:17:04 Just like your neighbor in Pennsylvania your friend is doing with his milk. I'm gonna, that's exactly how the change occurs. I've 00:17:09 Got a hunch for you on the beef thing first. This, this came about even back when I had my little hobby steer operation out here that, you know, 00:17:16 keeping them on grass then created what a, the Omega-3 or whatever that thing Is. Right. Do you have a trophy for 00:17:20 that? Somewhere around here. It feels like you got a medal or a trophy for everything. Damian. I dunno 00:17:26 If I ever told you, I dunno if I ever told you that in 1986 I had the reserve champion dairy steer at the Hunting County four H Fair. 00:17:33 I mean, that's some pretty mud stuff. I Bet that trophy's displayed in your house. It was two, It was two spears, But I got second. Yeah, that's 00:17:41 Right. So here's what, um, what I think is that that was the beginning of that maybe as long ago as 20 years ago. 00:17:47 I have a feeling that what you'll find is the more you're using cover crops and you're using things like the brassicas 00:17:52 and the, and maybe some alite clover and some, you know, whatever the, the mixture is that your stuff even will get better one year from now 00:18:01 or those steaks will be even more nutritious per ounce two years from now than they are now. Because we do know as much as I'm like, yeah, 00:18:09 those big feed yards in Kansas, you know, 20,000 steers out there, fine, great. But we know that that stake is not as nutritious per ounce 00:18:17 as some of the stuff that's raised a little bit differently. You're, You're right. 'cause they're pushing 00:18:20 pounds. You're right. Pounds of gain per day. That's what they're paid for. And then if it grades choice What you, that's what you grade yourself on, is 00:18:27 how many pounds per day you put in. You know, you got outta that Day. You're right about that forage. 492 00:18:32.165 --> 00:18:32.485 But the, it still is gonna come back to the corn because the research from Utah state that, you know, 00:18:37 the video I've watched in one of the labs, we're gonna send the meat off to the last 90 to 120 days that the cow are on feed has a huge implication, 00:18:47 uh, as, as of when they're on grass earlier in their life. So that last 90 to 120 days when we're feeding 00:18:52 that hotter ration is gonna matter. So like the, my corn is still, the corn plant is still a grass. 00:18:58 The basis of the ration is still silage. And so I need to improve that corn plant to, to get what you're talking about. 00:19:04 Everything you said is valid, but the last 9,820 days are very much weighted in this, in how the meat changes. 00:19:10 So Kelly, can we get enough, uh, nutrition in beef? Do you think that you don't have to consume a 32 ounce porterhouse at dinner? Or 00:19:19 We, we probably can, but some of that is for enjoyments. I hear you. You know what's interesting is there's only 00:19:26 to the point, there's only a couple of places where we are being paid for of content and beef. And that's really about how it grades. 00:19:35 It's not about nutrients. It's about fat Marble Fat about marbling, you know, and fat cover and, and speckles of, of fat in there and whatever. 00:19:42 And then dairy, you gotta be careful here. He's Mr. Anti-air. I know he is just angry. I mean he hates dairymen like me. 00:19:50 But anyway, you were paid on that milk based on if it was over three point something, 3.2% butterfat, 00:19:56 you started getting a premium, everything over that. And then protein content, um, that's It. And then protein 00:20:02 on the wheat, you know, you get dinged if it's not that it's due, it seems like it's absolutely due for this. 00:20:07 It seems like we're, it's 2025. How are we not better about saying if food is what fee, how are we not better at making it? Yeah. Better 00:20:17 Food is, food is health and, and we're all about quality and agriculture. We're all about quantity and agriculture. 00:20:23 And it needs to become more about quality. But I I think part of it too is how, you know, how the vast amount of consumers, I mean they don't, 00:20:32 they don't connect the dots. And that's what we have to do as an industry. Like, uh, you know, I always say that, you know, 00:20:39 I'm in the fertilizer industry. So when we deliver, when we've mine fertilized or refined it and we deliver that to a crop, 00:20:46 the crop is like we are, they need nutrients. That's the crop's, vitamins. Well, if we don't take it to that crop, 00:20:53 that crop doesn't have the choice to get up and drive to the local store and buy vitamins. Whereas you look at us as humans, 00:20:59 what do we do every morning? We get up what, oh wait, what did we not get from our food? Well we know we need calcium, 00:21:05 phosphorus and things like that. We take vitamins and yet vitamins aren't considered, you know, evil or chemical in nature 00:21:14 and we take 'em every day. And yet the very vitamins or fertilizer that we carry out to that crop is considered to be chemical. Mm-hmm. 00:21:22 Well, you could, you can justify that and talk about how, you know, when you're taking a vitamin that would be kind of like synthetic. 00:21:29 I mean that's correct. And it, and the body's not gonna absorb that to same, that it is out of a nutrient 00:21:35 Rich or a piece of bread. 100% Correct. And then how many times when a person takes that vitamin, have they actually looked at the, uh, is it, 00:21:43 is it available to you? Mm-hmm. You know, there's different sources of magnesium. Some are more, some are less available. 00:21:48 We talk about that all the time. Yeah. Like with your products. But yet humans will just go take 00:21:52 the vitamin 'cause it's on the shelf. That Was what I was gonna bring up to Galen's point is, I mean, it's been a long time since FFA livestock production 00:22:00 where I learned about rations, but what they call it total digestible, uh, such as total digest, meaning there's stuff that we eat 00:22:08 and that animals eat that it's, you can consume it all you want, but it is gonna go in and out because it's not digestible. 00:22:14 Right. That's right. And that's where I think this nutrient discussion also goes. 00:22:17 'cause you could make the argument, Galen, we've got a whole bunch of obese Americans, they're extracting calories outta stuff, 00:22:24 but they're clearly not getting whatever their body is seeking because they're just eating and eating the tray and satisfy whatever their body 00:22:31 Wants. Does, does, does this get rid of the whole, you know, I, I have a gluten in intolerance. 00:22:37 I have, I'm lactate lactose intolerant. I'm, I got allergies. I got this. Think about back when you 00:22:44 and I were kids, I don't know that I knew anybody that had an allergy. Yeah. Aside from seasonal allergies and made some, 00:22:51 But I don't know anybody. That seems Like there's probably some people that allergies penicillin, theia the 00:22:56 Other, but we ate very differently back then. Yeah. When I was a young kid. Yeah. And, you know, when my parents were kids, like, I mean, I, 00:23:03 I don't know that mom and dad probably ever knew a human being that had of even a seasonal allergy. 00:23:10 Like what was that? And what, you know, we're sitting here discussing this and we, we've talked a little bit about, uh, crop health. 00:23:17 And I've made the point before in some of these that, hey, if we can prevent disease in crop 00:23:23 and it costs $60, will a farmer do that Versus a $10 shot from an airplane? And I think we, we can produce more nutrient dense food. 00:23:33 The thing that will be a little bit challenging is would the consumer still go eat carbohydrates or go get the Krispy Kreme donut? 00:23:42 Right. And then I'm probably in trouble for Krispy Kreme donuts now, but, uh, where they go eat that and take a pill to offset it. 00:23:50 I mean that, that's, we have to get to where we're not dependent on external treatments. We, we as an industry, and it's hard 00:23:58 because I grew up in ag. We as an industry have to own that. We have to put a better product. 00:24:03 We've got, here's the thing that, because you and me both are, can we almost probably get accused by some of our peers in Ag Galen that we're being anti ag? 00:24:11 No. We want a better ag and also we step out away from ag and see more perspectives that a lot of our peers don't. 00:24:20 That's where I'm like, listen, I'm in the suburbs in the affluent part of Phoenix, uh, part of the time. 00:24:26 And tell me, tell me, lemme tell you one thing. They don't go to Whole Foods necessarily because what we think they go there for, 00:24:34 they really do want a better product. Yeah. And whether it is or isn't, and I can get into all that. 00:24:39 So this idea is the consumer clearly wants a better product and we could make it for them. And the thing is, give the American farmer the incentive. 00:24:50 'cause we know that the, the farmer will absolutely, some won't, they'll just keep doing what they've always done. 00:24:55 But the more forward, the kind of people that watch this show and are extreme ag people, you give them the financial incentive, you'll do it. 00:25:02 You know what, absolutely. I can make 20 more dollars an acre. All I gotta do is make these three changes. Yep. Done. 00:25:07 And, and I think that we're getting there, and I, and I think that there's where this whole, you know, sustainable farming, regenerative agriculture move, 00:25:15 and as we take this shifts, it's gonna naturally occur. And, and I think it's already naturally occurring. The problem is, is a lot of guys can't make that, 00:25:25 just can't make that move every night because it costs money to make that move. I, I, I think that's key is that, you know what, 00:25:32 what a lot of people here is, I gotta spend money. It's painful. I am. Yeah. I, I'm not gonna lie, 00:25:38 but, uh, I think, you know, we've always worked in agriculture that our market is always expanding 00:25:44 because there's growth in population and let's worry about meeting the calories to, to meet that demand. 00:25:51 Well, I think we're at that point where we realize at some point that that population isn't expanding. 00:25:59 What's our next way to provide some value to really a shrinking marketplace? And I think this is what it's gonna have to be. 00:26:07 I mean, I felt like, you know, a couple years ago, Kelly, when when we were, you know, talking all these people 00:26:13 and we start talking about the CI score, that was the hope for me for the CI score. 00:26:18 You know, when you talk about that, that person then knows that they are buying a nutrient rich source of food 00:26:25 or, um, clothing that was grown, that was grown the right way. Yeah. I, I thought that that's 00:26:32 where it was really gonna move to. And the lower your CI score got, you know, the less effect that you had on less impact you had on the environment, 00:26:40 I really thought that that's where it was going. And, and there's still a chance for that. And then the lower your CI score, you know, with the 45 Z, 00:26:48 it implemented that, hey, you could get more money per bushel. And the better that you did, the more that that's, 00:26:55 other than that, I don't see another way to incentivize for farmers to do this. I I don't either. And that, and that was a tax credit, 00:27:02 which it is or is not a regulation. Uh, but at least the 45 Z tax credit, whatever happens to it, we still don't know. 00:27:09 Uh, that's farming with a carrot instead of a stick behind you. Mm-hmm. Yeah. And so that's a, 00:27:14 that's the nice way to have the regulation. I, uh, I don't know how to pay farmers to do, to be more nutrient dense either than just consumer demand. 00:27:22 Uh, I don't know. And, and the, the CI score on the product was a very nice metric. You know, the word sustainable at times could be accused 00:27:30 of being overused or, uh, it, it can be a baseless claim either. That's why the score, the number, 00:27:35 the actual metric is a very concrete thing that is needed instead of just a, uh, thank you. A blanket stain sustainable Thank, 00:27:42 Thank you. Because I was gonna say the one, you need a number. The one thing is this is measurable. 00:27:46 How much zinc per ounce of steak, how much riboflavin, whatever you name your, your, your yeah. Your nutrient as opposed to marketing 00:27:58 sustainable, uh, you know, family friendly, uh, earth good, you know, all the, all the various adjectives. 00:28:05 Were just almost on version. It's gonna be very disappointing to me as a farmer. And it should be very disappointing to a consumer. 00:28:10 If you start to see the term nutrient dense and it's not followed by a metric of a number. That's What, that's, If sustainability is replaced 00:28:18 by nutrient dense, that's very Disappointing. But here, here's the challenge with that. 00:28:21 And I agree with you guys wholeheartedly, but you know, in general, if you look, if you, if you were to go look up nutritional content of carrot, I mean, 00:28:30 they'll tell you how, what are the nutrients mm-hmm. Contained in a carrot. Well, that's kind of misleading 00:28:35 because you give me a carrot that was grown organically that's on a soil with zero nutrition. There is no question those nutrient 00:28:43 guidelines don't apply to it. Right. And go give me a carrot organically grown off of a nutritious soil. 00:28:49 It's loaded with nutrition. Yeah. You Put two carrots on this table and they could have a very 00:28:54 different, different, very different. So that's where it, it's measurable, but nobody goes right from the grocery store over to the lab 00:29:00 and says, go ahead and, uh, start testing this and tell me what, um, what the content of vitamin B is in this stuff. 00:29:06 Yeah. I mean, that's dog Bug. You kind of hope this in consumers when this airs that maybe at at least they, 00:29:12 it would be nice if consumers knew that that growers are having these discussions. How do we do better 00:29:19 and put better, uh, more nutritious food on the table? The growers at the grainery table are having this discussion, not enough. 00:29:25 Others are. But I believe that it's starting to catch. And you know what? You can say, oh, well I don't know if I want a certain politician, you know, 00:29:31 RFK, I don't mind that this discussion is being had. And I think that those of us who are at the front of ag are like, this is where it's going. 00:29:38 And it probably should, you can make more money and, and the consumer can be healthier. What, what's wrong with that? 00:29:43 There's nothing wrong with it, but we just gotta find this a starting spot. His name's Temple Rhodes. He is joined by Kelly Garrett. 00:29:50 They're two of the ex extreme ag guys. We're joined by our good friend Galen Beer with Agri Liquid. Agri Liquid is sponsoring this episode of the Grainery 00:29:56 and several other episodes of The Grain. We're very happy to have them here. Agri Liquid is how these guys actually get the fertility 00:30:01 right on their crops and they don't have to break the bank, uh, and don't do things like their grandfather did 00:30:05 by flinging out dry fertilizer unnecessarily. They put it where it needs to be and you can target the target 00:30:10 to when the plant actually needs it. And if you wanna learn more about their product, where do they go? 00:30:13 Galin agri liquid.com. Agri liquid.com. One of our business partners here, extreme Ag are happy to have 'em. 00:30:18 So anyway, next time, we want you to come here because this is the Grainery and we are all about talking about big stuff 00:30:23 that happens in agriculture, the personal side of agriculture. It's all truth. It's all real. 00:30:26 And it's all real farm people, real ag people like Gayland and me right here. So's. Next time. Cheers. Now wait a minute. 00:30:33 You gotta keep talking about stuff while I go and get You this. Hey, go. You wanna get medal? Hey, you your medal? Yeah. 00:30:38 Carry a trophy out. I'm gonna sew it right here. Now, if you hadn't seen this, You know why I brought it up? Because 816 00:30:45.335 --> 00:30:46.395