Are Ag Schools Still Relevant? | The Granary

00:00:09 Yes, that is the graduation march. Sometimes those pomp and circumstance, and you're saying, Damien, why are you singing that? 00:00:14 Whistling it, as it were from the grainery, because I'm asking a question. Our agricultural universities still 00:00:21 relevant in this day and age? Maybe they are, maybe they aren't. We're gonna find out when I talk 00:00:26 to my friends here in the Grainery. You ready for a conversation with some real farmers about real issues? 00:00:32 The best part. You're invited. Support yourself. A drink, grab a snack. Most importantly, pull up a chair. Welcome to the Grainery. Hey guys. 00:00:51 Alright guys, you heard the topic. This is something that you and I have actually discussed. I said let's do it in the grainery, 00:00:57 our agricultural university still relevant. It's the mid 2020s for crying out loud. We got all kinds of ai. 00:01:04 We got a technological revolution going on. We've got consolidation going on in the industry. We've got people making a whole bunch of money 00:01:12 that are out here becoming pipe fitters and HVAC people. And yet we're still cranking out folks with 00:01:18 ag agricultural degrees. And so I'm questioning to you, are they still relevant? The land grant whole thing came about in the 1860s. 00:01:28 Great, wonderful. Does it still matter? Tommy Roach is my guest. He is also our sponsor. He is with Nature's the sponsor of this show, joined 00:01:36 by Texas, Todd Kimbrel with Extreme Ag, and the founder of Extreme Ag. Kelly Garrett. Alright, you got kids that went 00:01:42 to Iowa State, you went to Iowa State, Texas Tech, you didn't go to college. I went to an ag school. I tell you what, 00:01:49 you're doing better than a whole bunch of people that I graduated with. I'm not sure that it matters. 00:01:54 And I'm also still questioning the value of an agricultural university today and moving forward. I can make the argument both ways. Let's start with you. 00:02:02 You want the long answer or short answer? Short, then we'll expand. No and no, They're not relevant anymore Unless the end. 00:02:10 They have not been willing to change their ways. They're still trying to prove, and we talked about it earlier, they're still throwing out 00:02:19 1960 information. And I realize some universities are better than others. We can get into that. But in general terms, they got some, 00:02:30 they got some changing to do. All right. He, he's really correct. Uh, you know, the, the degree in agronomy 00:02:38 that Connor got from Iowa State has been useful on the farm. The agronomic knowledge he has 00:02:42 and things like that has really helped. It has leapfrogged him ahead of where I was at the same age. However, some of the research 00:02:49 that the university's put out isn't, it, is not progressive enough. You know, e even, you know, you talk about, I've heard 00:02:55 of the 1960s stuff, but even, even if it's 15-year-old information. And, and so, uh, you know, to a, to, to a farmer that wants 00:03:04 to continue to do things the way they always have, it probably is relevant information. But to people that are trying to be progressive and to push 00:03:11 and to learn new things, the idea of what the university's supposed to do is, is this cutting edge research. 00:03:17 It's not cutting edge anymore. Agricultural universities are supposed to be at the front end of this thing, cutting edge. 00:03:23 Are they anymore? Hey, you know, in production, it's tough. I, I struggle with that a lot. 00:03:28 But on the flip side of that too, like the, the ag eco and policy side, I see a lot of good things coming out of that on specifically policy. 00:03:38 I mean, there's a lot of good things there. So that, see, See, it's to two totally different things, right? 00:03:43 It did. So if you're talking about that, it's one thing because I agree with you, but in production terms, they're, they're still trying 00:03:50 to prove why broadcast fertility, it works, why Foer fertility doesn't work. And I get the, I guess the blessing 00:04:03 or the, the not so much blessing. I travel the us Some universities are better than others. I mean, I've done research at like for watermelons, 00:04:14 Clemson University's kind of the voice of the Southeast and they're good at it. I mean, LSU sugarcane, if I was gonna do cotton research, 00:04:23 which I do, unfortunately, it is not going to be the land-grant, uni, university of Texas, it will be Texas Tech 00:04:33 because there are a whole lot more in tune with what's going on with in the cotton world than my opinion a and m is. Well, 00:04:40 And that's geographical because the cotton universe is right within a few minutes of Lubbock. 00:04:44 And so you can see that. So here's the thing. You're talking about the value of an agricultural university in terms of its research, 00:04:51 and that tends to be all about production. And you're saying some of 'em are good, and then some of 'em are antiquated. 00:04:57 And Iowa State's over here, second biggest ag state in the union, and they're cranking out, Verns coming out with, you know, 00:05:05 information from the 1960s. And he acts like they guy that was born in the 1960s, but the thing is, or forties. 00:05:11 But the thing is, um, I, I guess I can argue that you just, you just said that first off, they're not all created equal. 00:05:19 And secondly, they each have their specialty area. But Todd says, well, about the economics, I I can argue that I get a lot of stuff from Purdue, 00:05:28 university of Illinois, Iowa State School of Agricultural Economics, because that tends to be data. But again, talking about relevance, we did this before. 00:05:39 I might be able to get that data compiled, uh, from an AI source. I don't know that I need 14 professors in the agricultural 00:05:46 economics department with 28 teacher's assistants and, uh, assistants under that compiling this data. Two people could do this. I think 00:05:55 that we still might have the issue of overloaded institutions that are doing stuff that's repetitive, even on the agricultural economic side. 00:06:03 That reminds me of the 1960s. Uh, I, I could see that, you know, I, I, I use AI a lot, uh, when I'm compiling numbers 00:06:10 and statistics, things like that. But, you know, I sometimes question, uh, if it's relevant. You know, I, I don't always know if I trust it. 00:06:17 You know, what Iowa State Extension puts forward for, you know, for the custom rates and things like that. We, we use that, uh, very extensively for the, you know, 00:06:26 we custom farm about a thousand acres. And we, we do use that information very extensively. Is it, is it over bloated? 00:06:32 How, how they gather the information? Maybe I, I don't know. But I, that is one area that we do find it valuable. 00:06:38 Universities tend to be like governments and governments tend to have a lot more employees doing, uh, repetitive tasks. 00:06:44 So that's where I'd say relevant. Sure. Uh, efficient. No, no, I, yes, I, I would agree with the efficiency probably. 00:06:51 So I do, I do research all over North America. And the thing about land-grant universities, go back to what you just said. 00:07:00 It's about government. Government tends to be too big. It is for me, cost prohibitive to do any research with, generally speaking, any research 00:07:15 with land grant universities because it costs two dead gum much money where I can go to a CRO third party researcher Yep. 00:07:24 And do it for a, a fraction of the cost. So me being a little fertilizer company do, is that the same, is that the same viewpoint 00:07:35 as everybody else in the industry? And maybe they just don't get to see what I'm, what I'm trying to promote. 00:07:42 I don't know. Well, the member that there's been a big knock that agriculture universities were hijacked by Big Ag. 00:07:48 We hear that from in and outside of agriculture. And so they'll come up with whatever findings they're paid to find. 00:07:54 Yeah. And that, I've heard that before. You've heard that. Alright. You didn't go to, uh, agricultural university. 00:08:02 What, what do you think you missed? What are you, 43 years old? 42? Yeah. Alright, 00:08:07 so 20 years ago you would've gotten out. What do you think you didn't get? What do you think you've missed? If anything? 00:08:15 I, you know, I would've, which is probably not to do with the ag actually. Not at all. No, I'm not talking about the getting drunk 00:08:21 and the party and all that stuff. We know that you Didn't do any of that though. Actually I didn't. I got, I got to miss all that. 00:08:27 I had to work, but I went to a technical school. Do you think you missed anything? The, the business and finance portion? 00:08:36 I do wish I could have had more knowledge on that. 'cause it took me a long time to figure that out the hard way. 00:08:41 Learned it on your own. Yes. That was, you made some mistakes. Absolutely. But you know, that, that's how most, how 00:08:46 best learning happens is by, And that's a fair, that's fair. But I mean, I really started from scratch 00:08:52 with no know-how on any of that stuff. So it was tough. So I do, I haven't been, never went. So I don't know what exactly I missed. But 00:09:00 Do you use, Okay, as a 42-year-old, do you use university agricultural university data today? You sounds like you do. 00:09:10 Uh, probably limited, but a little bit. There's a reason he said limited because I find that every, 00:09:20 every state has published, uh, NPK rates by what your sole test says. I mean, every state does it. And when was that? 00:09:32 When were those studies done? Fifties. Yeah, I was gonna say 60, 70 years ago. 70 years ago. 50 years ago. And they, by God, 00:09:40 I'm not gonna change those numbers. Uhhuh, I, I'll give you an example. Uh, we, I've worked with the extension 00:09:50 station in Lubbock, which is a and m it's a joint appointment between tech and a and m. But it, they found that, 00:09:58 and we're in the Lubbock is the cotton capital of the world, right? 40 uh, 30 continuous counties 00:10:07 around there grow more cotton in the world if it rains. So we proved that the potassium numbers were not accurate. You needed to put on more potassium than 00:10:18 what published Texas a m data said even though there was this pile of numbers that proved it, what would Texas a and m not do? 00:10:30 They would not change their recommendations. That's true. Because the old guard people in College 00:10:35 Station would not do it. Mm-hmm. And I, I could show you examples all across the country that that happens. Which the 00:10:44 Problem then is first off, they are paid for by us. They were set up by a taxpayer land grant, meaning the federal government granted land to be sold 00:10:53 to raise money for that school. And there are still tax dollars that go into there, et cetera, et cetera. 00:10:57 They're doing a disservice. They're doing a disservice as a bureaucracy of No, we're not changing that. They've, you can argue that they are being irresponsible 00:11:06 with the money that we gave them to perpetuate what they're supposed to be doing To, uh, to complete research for the American farmer. 00:11:13 Yeah. That's what their job was. Yeah. Yeah. And, and now they're Not doing it to technically. 00:11:18 And I'm, I'm a big land-grant school fan to advance the agricultural and mechanical arts. And it was all about things 00:11:25 that we needed for a growing country. More prosperity, more growth, more production, uh, engineering and ag and ag education. 00:11:31 And I just, my problem is I think that they've veered from that. Uh, my alma mater is not, uh, known 00:11:38 as the Ag school that it once was. And I think that they, uh, are fine with that. I think Go Ahead. Go ahead. Who was 00:11:43 that? Who was That? Uh, that's a place called Purdue University. Okay. But I, I, Hey, let's lay it all out here. 00:11:48 Well, I don't, don't be bashful. Well, I don't think, I don't think that they're doing, I don't think they're doing the service to the industry 00:11:54 that they once did. And more importantly, that they were set up to have done in the 1860s. 00:12:01 I think they've lost their, their vision. I think they're much more about, uh, being a liberal arts, you know, they've got liberal arts 00:12:06 programs and all that kind of stuff. And yeah, there's still an ag campus, but I don't think they're on any way cutting edge. 00:12:11 And I think that they've sort of hor out and Well, what does that do? That doesn't help the kid from a farm in Indiana to go and, 00:12:18 and become successful in agriculture. So they've lost sight of the Damian Masons. And we're, and I'm a much so are 00:12:24 They relevant? Probably maybe still relevant, but have they lost sight of their, uh, vision at incarnation? 00:12:30 1000000%. They're supposed to be to take kids like me off the farm that could go there and, and help advance this business. 00:12:37 So we we're talking about, we're, I'm sitting here amongst extreme ag guys and even the people that aren't here, 00:12:46 we've proven that it doesn't take a pound of nitrogen to produce a pound of corn. A bushel of corn. Right. Right. 00:12:54 But yet you go to any land grant. I I any university. Yeah. And they still push the notion that, 00:13:04 that that's got to happen. Yeah. When Connor was a junior at Iowa State, he told me he had to write a variable rate prescription for nitrogen for corn. 00:13:13 And, uh, I said, well, are you gonna write it the way that we do at home? And then, so let me say the way we would do it at home, 00:13:19 the higher yielding ground gets less nitrogen and is probably down towards 0.3 or 0.4 pounds of nitrogen for bushel, you know, up to, 00:13:28 you know, 0.8 or nine, maybe one, depending on if it rains Right. On the lower yielding ground. And the reason is it, it, it, 00:13:35 it actually probably does take a pound of nitrogen to produce a, a bushel of corn. But why don't we give credit to the organic Exactly. 00:13:40 Why Do we think it all has to be synthetic and the way, and so, and so I, I'm putting less nitrogen on the higher yielding areas. 00:13:48 And I said, so are you gonna write it the way we write it? Or, or how are you gonna do? 00:13:51 He said, dad, if I write it the way you write it, I'll flunk. And you know, and I, I've told the professors at Iowa State 00:13:57 that I'm like, we, and they, and they know, they know that they're behind and they're trying to catch up. 00:14:01 So I give them credit for that. But it's still a disservice to the farmer. And I, I think some of it is, you know, 00:14:06 government has gotten bigger and, and the university is a bit of an extension of the government and they're not very nimble and, and it's, 00:14:13 and they don't want, and it's hard to change. Well, Also what's, what's the incentive to change? Are they gonna go out of business? 00:14:19 No. So there's the thing, what would you Well, they business to be relevant? Well, I says if ag universities are relevant 00:14:25 and Okay, you said I probably missed out if I had gone to an Ag University, I would've gotten the business and the economic part of it and some of that stuff. 00:14:34 And, and we all agreed. You learn a lot of that on the fly by coming out here and getting the real world anyhow. 00:14:39 But yeah, the fundamentals would've been there. What do you want from 'em? Now as a 42-year-old Texas farmer doing very well, 00:14:45 you're successful, what could the uni, what could an AG university doesn't have to be in Texas, could be anywhere. 00:14:51 What would they do for you to become relevant? You know, um, they still have scientists, so to speak, involved in this extension. 00:15:01 And we use, I don't wanna slide these people at all, 'cause some of 'em do a lot of really good work. So there's like scientists, like soil scientists 00:15:10 that test carbon and kind of really give us a direction on what the actual carbon stuff is happening. 00:15:18 So I would say like, on a real, real deep level, like the scientific stuff that's really hard for us to do or to learn, that stuff's really important. 00:15:30 And I still push for that. Uh, so I guess it'd be more like that and to get more progressive in general, which, 00:15:37 So you want the science? Yes. Do you need a notice that comes from the agriculture, the Texas Ag, Texas a and m uh, extension. 00:15:44 Um, 'cause that used to be a thing, right? You get bulletins and we'd get newsletters from Purdue, you know, publications. 00:15:50 Publications If you will. And, and that kind stuff. Does it do anything for you? No, not really. So we just answered there a lot 00:16:00 of your relevance for our friend Todd, or is it relevant to you? You're a farmer. Does Iowa State 00:16:05 right now do anything for Garrett? Land and cattle? The, the custom work data? Uh, there's some, you know, like some marketing data, 00:16:15 things like that when they're talking about, you know, federal crop levels, things like that. The, the agronomy, um, I wish was more progressive. 00:16:23 I'd say the data, again, I think the data, but I think that if it takes you 47 cast members and uh, faculty members to compile this, okay, great. 00:16:32 You know, it's, to me, it's like the government. Okay, yeah, you did this thing, but you didn't do it in any way 00:16:37 that private industry probably would've done so. Well, And I, I don't want to make it sound like I'm bashing totally bashing land universities. 00:16:47 'cause every every university has a, has a segment that they're good at. You know, Kansas State 00:16:53 and Irrigation University of Illinois has done a lot recently with, uh, like strip tillage. Um, and, and those are great. 00:17:03 I mean, I could go out west, um, Colorado state on something on beef Colorado Potatoes, Oregon. 00:17:09 I do, I mean, I've been doing potato research at Oregon State for the last 10 years. Great. But one of the problems is, and it, and it's 00:17:19 because of it's big government, it's, it takes me three to five years to find, to, to do the research to find something new and get it started. 00:17:32 Whereas, you know, big land grant universities don't, they're not that nimble. They can't just change, change course in a, 00:17:40 in a blink of an eye. They can't follow the science like you and I Want. No, they can't. 00:17:44 Okay. We talked a lot about the research. That's cool. Let's talk about the next generation. Your daughter wants to be in agriculture. 00:17:50 Your son wants to be in agriculture. They're 14, 18 years old. You gonna send them to an ag school? 00:17:56 My daughter really is dead set on going, but my son doesn't want to, and I'm frankly not gonna force him to, 00:18:02 but I, I mean, I would encourage him to do some finance and business classes, but with things like re you know, extreme ag research 00:18:11 or honestly, Tommy Roach is a wealth of knowledge in our souls. He's one of the most knowledgeable guys where we farm 00:18:18 and understands my soul. But you can't go and hang out with Tommy for four and a half years and watch football games and drink. 00:18:23 Well, I mean, you probably could, but that's all you're gonna do if you go to college. But is your kid gonna go to college 00:18:27 and do, is your kid gonna go to college and would you want them to go to college so they could even if two years of it was unnecessary, 00:18:38 come back with the other two years that was valuable. I would encourage it. But, uh, my son's not going to, my daughter will absolutely do it, but my son won't. 00:18:47 So that's a loaded question. I'm 50 50 on that question. Um, I obviously, I wouldn't encourage her 00:18:55 to go if I didn't think she would gain, wouldn't gain something. Right. So now is my son gonna miss stuff? 00:19:01 I think so, but like I'm encouraging to like, do some kind of finance and business course, not even with a university. 00:19:08 I don't even care where it is. Alright. You got a kid that, uh, you know, three kids obviously, but the two that are with us, there's the one 00:19:14 that graduated, one went for one year. What's the one that went one year missing? I can say a lot of things, but also 00:19:19 I can say maybe not that much. You know, I, I sometimes think there's value. Um, uh, you know, like I, I went to Iowa State, 00:19:27 I lasted three semesters and I quit. And then I worked construction and stuff and let's, I didn't want to come home till Amber did. 00:19:32 You know, honestly. And, uh, so I stayed in Ames for five years and I, I see the value of going 00:19:38 and living away from home for a while and being on your own and then coming back because you're gonna grow up 00:19:42 and do some things in that time. Uh, you, you have some personal growth in yourself. And then like, I sometimes feel like 00:19:49 you're always viewed as a kid. Mm-hmm. Because you never, never have that disconnect. Hmm. You know, even kale going away for a year. Mm-hmm. 00:19:55 He, he still went away for a year, things like that. Um, you know, and when he first came back and things like that, you know, he was still young. 00:20:02 There was a couple rough patches. Now he's, that's Not ag, that's not Aggie versus specific. No. That's just, that's part of, that's just, 00:20:07 that's a lot. That's, That's, that's just life. And, and so there, there's value to going to school, to, there's, there's more than academics. 00:20:15 You, you're learning to live with people that are outside your, your comfort zone and you're learning to get along with people 00:20:20 and you're just learning to grow up a little bit. And so, regardless if it's an ag school, I think there's value in doing 00:20:25 and just broadening your horizons. What does the ag, what do the ag universities need to do to remain relevant? 00:20:30 In your point, you've talked a lot about research, and I get that, but is beyond research to remain relevant. Is that it? 00:20:37 Well, that, that's their, that was their mission statement and, and they've kind of drifted 00:20:40 away from it. That's the whole problem. Well, also it, that extension thing was really important in the late 18 hundreds because you had essentially a, a whole bunch 00:20:50 of settlers that were eighth grade educated and all of a sudden the extension was, you're supposed to have this educated person that went out 00:20:59 to the counties like this one right here and say, here's the better way to grow potatoes and here's a better way to can green 00:21:06 beans to feed your family. I mean, you're talking about it 140 years ago. Right. The extension of the education was, the whole concept 00:21:13 can argue that the internet has made a lot of that antiquated at best, even before The internet. It was antiquated. 00:21:20 It was antiquated. So that, that, if the extension is less relevant today, and if the research that's being done is apparently they 00:21:28 still use the 60-year-old, 70-year-old, uh, recommendations, then I think it comes down to the business part of it 00:21:34 and the compiling of data. Um, but it's a pretty, there's a whole bunch of money that goes to those places for, 00:21:43 that's a pretty low return on investment. Now You're talking about compiling data a thing in your pocket with ai now, I mean, that's where that's going. 00:21:50 But it has to, it has to have a source. And that source could be University of Illinois and Michigan State and, uh, Cal Poly. 00:21:57 Then it conglomerates all that. And a MGA makes it into a, and then, so in other words, does AI get the data? 00:22:02 If we don't, if we don't have the Cal Poly data to start with? No, I, I, I don't think so at all. 00:22:08 I mean, my son, I've started keeping data, electronic data since 2011. I can tell you every single yield 00:22:16 and every square foot of every farm we farm since 2011. So my son's gonna have all that data somewhere to put it now. 00:22:25 Yeah. And compile it now. Yeah. With a lots of different layers. I think someday that data 00:22:31 that I started collecting back then is gonna be real vital going forward. At some point, they're gonna be able to 00:22:37 look at weather patterns and all the different things, stuff we haven't even thought about yet. But do we need someone, Todd, at, at Oklahoma State that 00:22:48 gathered it and then did the overlays and the analysis? And that's where their value is. They, they then can take that 00:22:56 and then make it, uh, com compile it into, now it's, oh, here's why this matters. Maybe, 00:23:04 Maybe today. But I think AI's gonna solve that. So Since we're in class, and I have to raise my hand interrupted. 00:23:11 Yes, Mr. So here's, Here's where I think we need to go with this. Take, take what land grant universities did 00:23:21 60 seventies use that as the baseline. Everybody nowadays does, you know, take soil tests, take tissue tests, 00:23:29 and that should be on these guys Yep. Plate to figure out to do the tweaks to make it meaningful, to take what Iowa State did 00:23:45 take their data and make it meaningful to their seven, eight, 9,000 acre operation. I don't think, I don't think land-grant universities are 00:23:54 ever going to catch up with how fast things are changing. I mean, look, how fast does a corn hybrid stick around? 00:24:03 How fast does the soybean hybrid or variety stick around? Well, even Two or three years, Tommy, on Tommy, those companies used 00:24:09 to be right in bed with all of those laying universities. And I don't think they are as much anymore. 00:24:14 They went and set up their own research more and more. Am I right about that? No, you're right. They're doing it less in conjunction with a co, uh, 00:24:20 an Ag college and more just on their own because they're moving at a faster Pace. Faster pace. 00:24:26 That's Right. Well, my point is, Kelly said he wants to be able to farm by the square foot. 00:24:31 Yep. And I think he's right. I don't need to know about any of his square feet. No, you don't. So my ai, if I have enough data, 00:24:38 data compiled, it ought to be able to at some point. I'm not saying it's there today. I'm not saying that it ought to take my data on my farm 00:24:47 with the way I managed it and spit out a dec. Like, okay, here's your analyticals. Right, right, right. Do you throw a, a ball or a strike analytics like sports. 00:24:58 Yeah. Right. Like that's where I think it's headed Now, I don't think there's a university in that chain though, is what I'm getting at. 00:25:05 You think that they become an unnecessary, they're not part of the conduit and they didn't add the value on the way. 00:25:10 But what if the Iowa State thing is compiling stuff from their labs and then doing the analytics and then it makes it so you can extrapolate 00:25:21 a, a tool from that. Like, oh, you know what they're doing in Iowa right now, and we know this because Iowa State, uh, followed 47 00:25:30 operators in, uh, you know, this geography and they experimented with this. And now I know that I can, I don't know, cut $47 out 00:25:39 of production because of those things or whatever. What if it's, what if there is, what if they are still doing something 00:25:45 because of the ability to, I don't know, harness their expertise in a geography to your point, and then spits it back out on 00:25:56 Yeah, I mean, it, it could po I I don't think we have any idea what's coming with it with AI. 00:26:02 And, and, and maybe that is, maybe, maybe they have their own program that that does it for us. Well, presumably the person from ames, Iowa that's a PhD, 00:26:09 is supposed to be able to then check and see that this AI stuff that you're getting is actually not wrong. 00:26:16 I mean, right now what if, uh, what if you put in there, should I spread mercury on my soil? 00:26:20 And it says, yes, Mercury's a brilliant, uh, micronutrient or whatever. Yeah, that's fair. I don't know. 00:26:27 I'm still asking the question I asked you the question are still That's a, that's a fair point, 00:26:30 but I mean, I think if you have all the data organized, you'll be able to to fact check that really quick. I, I think, well, 00:26:39 I think we've already decided that in many ways the extension thing has outlived its, uh, relevance. And I've worked for the extension people, 00:26:46 and I like those people a lot. But my goodness, look at where we are just from five years ago. I think that with the consolidation and ag 00:26:52 and the operation size growing and things like that, I think that the large operations need to, we need to conduct our own research, as you said, 00:26:59 by square foot, doesn't matter to you. You know? And, and, and that's, that's quickly changing where, you know, operations are growing more and more. 00:27:07 And we need to understand, we need to understand what's going on. And we, we much like, you know, 00:27:13 you talked about in earlier taping, uh, the soils like the ocean, that we, we have so much to learn and we, and, and it's so, you know, it, it, it's, it's 00:27:23 so much about our operation. We need to learn on our own soil. And something as basic as, 00:27:29 and this doesn't take a rocket scientist, something as basic as a micronutrient. 00:27:34 Mm-hmm. And I, I, the vast majority of these, what we're talking about would tell you they see no benefit of micros. 00:27:44 And I could, that is one thing that I can disagree with every day of the week and twice on weekends. Well, and you know, I do as well. Yes, 00:27:51 You do. So I mean, there's a lot of stuff and you keep going down the road of fertility, but we also do research 00:27:55 and we did like genetics and all that stuff. So I'm, I'm torn on it. Uh, the one that, you know, 00:27:59 Todd seems to think that AI can do it. I don't think we're quite there yet. I pull up, I pull up stuff on things like, uh, land values 00:28:07 on numbers on um, what, what, uh, I know you say, well, USDA does some of that stuff about production from geography or even country to country. 00:28:17 And I look at some of those analyses and I, I do see some, it's relevant to me for Now, but that's different than, so 00:28:25 he mentioned earlier about, you know, economics and statistics that falls in that bucket. Yep. I guess what I'm talking about is the production 00:28:35 Production. I Know that's a totally different bucket. I agree. And they're way behind. I Agree. Yeah. And I'm not, 00:28:40 and again, I'm not even sure that they're far enough ahead on the economics and the numbers because I think 00:28:45 that they've got huge departments that are compiling that. Uh, it's still a gravy train 00:28:50 to be a professor, unfortunately. I mean, let's face it, you don't have to do that much. I hate to throw somebody else under the bus, 00:28:56 but Well, what we're doing, look, we're doing all here. Look how, look how far USDA misses Yeah. 00:29:03 Yield every single, every single time they try to do it. I mean, it's not even fun. So you can 00:29:08 Even argue about whether those nu whether all of those staff of statisticians are relevant. Um, and, and that's another thing, 00:29:14 but back to the university thing. I guess we asked the question, are they relevant? So what do the university, is it, does it just need to fold? 00:29:22 We won't be able to watch those Texas Tech Red Raiders because you know, we, we like, we like to watch the football. 00:29:27 Thank you. Do the uni. And I I've bet money on 'em and won 'em lost. Thank you. Should the universe, should the AG University just go away? 00:29:36 Should, should Eames just become a nice little apartment complex? No, I don't believe so. I, you know, as we said, 00:29:42 the data we get, things like that are still relevant and still very useful. Uh, the research needs, the research just needs 00:29:49 to catch up to the times of possible. I would sure. Like to give them the chance to do that. It's a nice place to send your kid. 00:29:53 Yeah, but I mean, it's pretty expensive. Just if we're gonna send 'em somewhere, I mean, you can boarding schools, hell, you can send 'em 00:29:58 to Cayman Island or something like that. That's expensive too. I am, I'm Where what do you think should happen? 00:30:04 I don't know. I like it. I, I think maybe more focus on the, the ag policy stuff. I don't know. Iowa state's different. 00:30:13 Texas, the problem in my state is our state, our state Texas a and m is trying to cover all of Texas. We got five states in one. 00:30:23 I mean, it really is that big, right? Yeah. Think about the, think about the difference. It's Tough. Do you think the 00:30:27 High Plains is the same as Coastal Bend? It's so I'm more like Iowa than the High Plains. Exactly. I mean it's, it's 00:30:36 Like five states, but let's face it, you've got one uniting thing and that's that your, your pompous personalities, um, 00:30:42 and overbearing nature makes you really all Texans. That's true. Who, who's the guy sitting here in a dunks cap? 00:30:53 Yeah. A dunks cap. I do. I like That. It does Cap. No, it's A mortar board. It 00:30:57 Means that, it means that I'm scholarly. Yeah. Uh, professorial. Yeah. But like, think about the variability across Texas. 00:31:04 Well, you know, I would assume that Texas a and m has research farms around the state. They Do. And They do. Iowa State 00:31:10 has that as well. It just, we, the research needs to be more relevant. I agree. And they do. And was talking about your square 00:31:17 foot not mattering to me, but I'll even go a step further. My neighbor's square foot 00:31:22 really doesn't matter to me either. I No, I agree with that. Because he's done so he's managed so much differently. 00:31:26 Yep. Than me. Well, how does extension manage that, Right. Me and the neighbor? You can't. 00:31:32 Okay. So now when you point that out, maybe we are giving these universities the, uh, the universities has to go for generalities and the average. 00:31:41 And then when you want to drill down to the specifics that you and I do, they can't. Well, that's why I said maybe 00:31:46 We're complaining about something Else Possible. The baseline, right. And, and then take it from there on to the own farm deal. Yes. 00:31:53 But the baseline should still be past the 1960s. That's right. That's accurate. If you want me to fix the university, 00:31:59 the agriculture universities, first off, uh, and I've loved these people. I've worked for 'em. I think it start phasing out the 00:32:04 extension because it just has decreasing value every day. Uh, really, it, it's, I mean, it's become antiquated. 00:32:11 Uh, number two, let's say you better bring the ag back to the Ag University because a lot of these ag universities, 00:32:16 I think Kansas State's doing a great job, but I, I go to my own Alma Ma Purdue and I'm like, you've, you're, you're, 00:32:21 you're throwing ag out the window here all the time and putting in the other stuff. And um, obviously I think shaking up things get rid 00:32:29 of professor 10 years and all of a sudden you've got, uh, that research gets a lot more modern if all 00:32:34 of a sudden you're on the hot seat that you gotta produce instead of just, uh, coast, um, 00:32:38 I think things get a lot, lot more modernized. That's how I'd fix the ag universities. Make it more relevant. 00:32:41 Professor, 10 years old, are you also gonna put in term limits for Politicians? Yeah. 00:32:46 Yeah. I'll do that too. Yeah. I mean, what's the difference? So I, I'll mention something about research. 00:32:51 I'm on a research committee with Texas Corn Producers. We changed our, our method, we used to have the researchers from mostly Extension come to us 00:33:00 with ideas, with projects. And about a couple years ago we're like, this is irrelevant to what we want. 00:33:06 This, we, we completely scrapped that. We're gonna tell you what we want. The producers are from around the state as we are. 00:33:14 So now we've completely done a 180 with the way we research there. Now we're going to them about what we want to see. 00:33:21 I think it's gonna take more of that mentality to help. It's already starting to help, but I think we're in such a rut 00:33:26 of letting the researchers Yeah. Research what they thought we wanted. Yeah. Or needed. Yep. Now we've reciprocated that 00:33:33 and it's already started on a better path. Yeah. So all of a sudden we are, we are going to you with the our need and boom, start from there. 00:33:40 And, and it's gonna take a, like, it's gonna be a culture change. Yes. It's to make that happen. 00:33:45 And I talked about culture changes, uh, getting rid of 10-year-old. So, alright, last thought. 00:33:49 Make ag, make ag universities more relevant. How do I do it? That's a great idea right there. 00:33:55 I mean, there is, there are so many, like we go to commodity every year and there are so many people, 00:34:01 so many people from the different state agencies or Iowa Corn Board or uh, a SA that walk through there and they're still back in the sixties, seventies. 00:34:13 But, but I mean, slowly but surely there are, there's a new, like a new wave of growers that are finally opening up to this, 00:34:25 this new way of thinking. Well, Let me just tell you, it's great about old way of thinking. 00:34:29 Every ag school in this country, I'm sure is still trying to tell their kids we gotta maximize production 00:34:33 because by God we're gonna, we're all gonna starve if we don't feed the world. And that is 40-year-old information 00:34:40 because it's not even a situation anymore because of the vast surpluses. So anyway, I got Todd Kimble from Texas, I got Texas 00:34:47 resident also Tommy Roach with Nature's. They are a sponsor of this show and many of our other shows. So grateful 'em to be here, joined by my man, 00:34:53 Kelly Garrett right over here, who's really actually kind of envious because he doesn't like it 00:34:57 when I look smarter than him. And when I put on this Get Up, it absolutely kind of intimidated you did it. 00:35:03 I mean, very academic. His cap is bigger than your still very, Very academic, you would say, right? 00:35:08 I would say very ac I mean like, I feel like I could get up and give like the commencement address. 00:35:15 Anyway, so next time, thanks for being here. Thanks for pulling up a chair. If you enjoyed this shirt with somebody I can benefit from. 00:35:19 We asked the questions, are agriculture universities still relevant? Not, not a great, not a great endorsement from this table. 00:35:26 But anyway, give us your comments. We appreciate you, joy us here. Till next time, cheers. And thank you for nature for being the sponsor. 885 00:35:31.465 --> 00:35:32.205