Farming Podcast | Soil Health Strategies That Pay

00:00:00 Drivability, increasing your soil health, reducing your inputs, improving your economics. That's what we're digging into in this episode 00:00:06 of Extreme Ag, cutting the Curve with Temple Roads and Barrett ic. Welcome to Extreme ags Cutting the Curve podcast, 00:00:13 where real farmers share real insights and real results to help you improve your farming operation. And now here's your host, Damien Mason. 00:00:24 Hey there. Welcome to another fantastic episode of Extreme Ice, cutting the Curve. We're talking about thrive ability. What does that mean? 00:00:29 Well, it's a term that our man Barrett came up with two years ago when we were at Temple Roads Field Day. That's right. Great field day. 00:00:35 Lots of attendance, lots of cool stuff going on. And at that particular day I was there, we were talking about reduced, well, we ate seafood, 00:00:43 and somebody went over and decided to crack the, the, the crabs. He needed a tool. So Chad went over 00:00:50 and got into the bolt bin, and he brought out a good a hundred dollars worth of, and about a hundred pounds worth of bolts. 00:00:56 These things 'cause to, to break the crabs, you had to crack the damn things. And these little teeny hammers they gave us, you know, 00:01:02 the, the catering company. I'm like, that ain't gonna work. So we got some big old bolt. 00:01:06 And then Temple lost his mind and said, we're going through all of this hardware. And it was all great fun. But one thing that came outta 00:01:11 that, besides the fact that I learned how to eat crabs using a a pound and a half bolt, I learned that, um, 00:01:17 thrive ability is a term that we were talking about thrive in 25, survive in 25, and then Barrett says, I don't wanna just survive. 00:01:23 I wanna thrive. And I said, what's that mean? So anyway, he's turned it into an entire concept for his company, which is organics. 00:01:29 And Organics has been doing a lot of stuff with Temple, and it's all deriving around the idea of farmer economics, reducing your inputs, reducing your input costs, 00:01:38 and also increasing your soil health. You said something really important before we hit record bear. 00:01:42 You said, you know what, we really, organics was a crop input company and we view ourselves differently now, 00:01:48 and that's kind of where this whole thing is going. It's a bit of a mindset shift as well as a, I don't know, a, a concept now and, um, how your products fit into that. 00:01:57 Yeah, so I think, uh, originally we, you know, we came to market with a innovative product, uh, you know, consortium of microbes that helps farmers reduce fertilizer, 00:02:05 reduce tillage, improve soil health. And we were selling, oh, we've got this alternative input that fits into this space and other alternative inputs. 00:02:13 And you could talk about how we were better than others or different than others. Um, and that's fine. 00:02:18 And that was a great way for us to get into the market. But what we really started to see is that we weren't just selling inputs. 00:02:23 That wasn't really our mission. The inputs were a mechanism, but the mission was to be a partner to the grower 00:02:30 in helping drive soil health. We see soil health as really the economic engine to the farm, and if we can help improve that flywheel 00:02:39 of soil health for that farm, using our alternative inputs of, of our innovative consortiums 00:02:44 of microbes as a mechanism. But the real, the real mission is to, is to help be a partner in soil health. 00:02:49 And so once we changed that idea in our, in our own heads in how we were going to market, we then started 00:02:55 to really get focused on doing things like measurements. Um, we do a lot of soil testing. 00:02:59 We do, we, we have a whole platform where we do a photography, uh, below ground soil testing and, and pull, pull telematics off of the, uh, off 00:03:07 of the tractor and, and help the farmer look at all those pieces to the puzzle 00:03:11 and make better decisions around fertilizer efficiency, around, uh, reducing tillage and also helping to, to monetize sustainability assets 00:03:21 that are under the ground, um, because we're doing all this measurement. So it really changed our entire approach, 00:03:25 changed our entire conversation, and that really is thrive ability. It was a couple years ago, about the same time we were at, 00:03:31 uh, temples, when you came up with this Thrive ability, uh, concept where forever I've been doing these recordings 00:03:37 where we talk about, oh, these products increase soil health. And I'm like, that's a neat thing to say. 00:03:42 It's like, but how do you measure that? There's certain things that are like, uh, you know, I feel more vibrant. 00:03:48 Well, that's cool. Can we measure that? Right. And so your company is one of the few that I remember, you went into your trailer and actually broke out numbers 00:03:58 and your people talked about here's and, and did specific measurement. I thought quantifying some of these things that we throw 00:04:03 around loosely is neat, by the way, temple, are we quantifying it? Are we quantifying Thrive ability at Chestnut Marine Farms? 00:04:11 Absolutely, we are. I mean, when you think about, like, for me, you know, when, when they first came out here and they did like a, it was kind of like a little, um, 00:04:22 they kind of went, went arm to farm to farm, and they did these, these, these tests and they tested your soil for what it was, you know, 00:04:30 with a fungi a back, um, bacteria ratio. They did all these things. So it kind of like, it, it set the delta, right? 00:04:38 So they did a really, really good job of setting the delta, like, this is where you are, um, 00:04:43 before we've started on your farm, now let's see that where we can take it in the future. So it, it basically, 00:04:50 it definitely did quantify like where we're gonna go. Like we already set the delta, we wanted to figure out where we could go. 00:04:57 Um, and we figured out all these things. Now we had to change a few things. Like I wanted to change some of my practices. 00:05:04 I wasn't maybe as much of a no-till guy then, um, is what I am today, you know, would've, I've been with the company, um, working with Holganix 00:05:14 for three years now. This will be my oncoming, this will be my fourth year. And every year that goes by. 00:05:20 You know, for me, the most exciting thing was is I feel like where I am, you know, with our regulation, I felt like, I don't know 00:05:30 how much more I can cut fertility, right? So for me, it really wasn't about cutting fertility because I felt like I've done everything possible 00:05:41 and I can't possibly cut fertility any more than where I am today. Where this whole program came about, 00:05:50 about making soul healthy and being able to thrive, it became a kind of a deal where I can make fertility that much more efficient. 00:06:00 So in my mind, the name of the game is not cutting fertility because I felt like over 30 years 00:06:07 of being in this nutrient management, I've already cut it too as much or too much, you know? So can I possibly cut any more? 00:06:14 I don't know that I can, but where it's come, a part of it is what I do have out there. 00:06:21 It makes it available and the soul is healthy and it's vibrant and it's running, and it, you can actually see the tilt of the earth. 00:06:30 It changes. So when you can start to see those things, it really puts it in a perspective that's very different. Like just for the, the sole health benefit alone. 00:06:41 We don't realize what we've done over years and years and years of, you know, between, you know, plowing ground. Um, certain fertility are, are high in salt. 00:06:53 Like there's a lot of things That, I mean, certain dam damaging things you're saying, what we don't realize is the cumulative effect, right? 00:06:58 And I think, you know, we can joke about smoking, we can talk about, uh, being lethargic, whatever, sitting on your ass 00:07:04 and eating, uh, uh, potato chips is not necessarily bad. Sitting on your ass eating potato chips every day 00:07:11 for 30 years, the cumulative effect of that. Then all of a sudden you've atrophied, you've gotten, you know, you have more fat than 00:07:16 muscle, et cetera, et cetera. Same thing for your soil. That's the big Picture. Exactly. It's, 00:07:20 that's, that's the big picture. So put put this into perspective. So think about this for a minute. 00:07:25 Like, um, in the woods that we drive by, you know, or a forest, you know, you look at that and it's not been touched realistically by man, right? 00:07:35 We haven't gone out there and we haven't sprayed fungicides and we haven't put a whole bunch of fertility on it. 00:07:40 Now, could we have made that woods produce more? Um, possibly. But think about this. Like I've never, like a plant shows all 00:07:51 of its deficiencies really easily. It shows it on the leaf tissue, it shows it in the plant itself. 00:07:57 Like whether it's the stalk, whether it's the leaf tissue, but it shows it really easy. 00:08:02 Well, where it's different is, is how, when's the last time that you went by that your woods or your forest, 00:08:07 and you're like, man, look at the deficiencies in that plant. Like it's taking care of itself. 00:08:13 We have a, we have a whole world out there living under the soul that it's taking care of itself. 00:08:20 And that is soul health. It's, it's done everything that it needs to do. It's taken care of itself. It is self-sufficient. 00:08:27 It is out there running this program is about getting so healthy and being able to like work together. Like, and we can actually make something outta this. 00:08:38 And it's making big differences as we go, Hey, uh, Barrett, I don't wanna throw it out there. We know that cutting the curve is a talk show. 00:08:46 Temple takes that very literally, and when you give him the mic, he'll run with it for six minutes right there, uh, uninterrupted. 00:08:52 I'm just trying to figure out a way to shut you up. I'd say there's a whole bunch of stuff there. I think the biggest thing, bear from my perspective, 00:09:01 to be honest, this is I'm not like, uh, you know, blowing sunshine up your skirt. You said we stopped viewing it as being a company 00:09:09 that sells crop inputs and instead partnering in driving soil health and reducing inputs and improving economics. 00:09:16 Uh, again, that sounds like, like some sort of like, companies come up with mission statements and all this sort of happy horse s**t. 00:09:23 And a lot of times it's just that. But the point here is, yeah, you obviously want to stay in business. 00:09:28 You want to keep the doors open, you want organics to be here tomorrow, you to do that, you have to sell a product and you know, 00:09:33 have a profit margin, et cetera, et cetera. You're talking about a holistic approach to organics. In other words, we, this is really where we're going 00:09:41 and yeah, we're also selling product to do that. And I think that's kind of a, yeah, a cool big picture. And I'll tell you, David, it, it actually influences the 00:09:48 entire strategy of the company. Once we got our, our, once we got really clear on this, then we started to get really serious about our data. 00:09:55 So we started off going out and as Temple said, doing some microbiome TER tests in the field, doing some quick probe tests 00:10:02 to show the farm where it is today. And then we could come back in a year and show where it is, you know, at the end of the end 00:10:07 of using the product for, you know, for a full season. And we showed some nice benefits. And that was, that was really great. 00:10:13 That was just the start though. Once we realized, no, no, we're, we're the partner in helping drive soil health 00:10:18 and helping the farmer make better decisions economically, we then started getting a lot more 00:10:22 sophisticated work with our testing. So today, um, if you're on our full program, you, you get, um, we do soil testing at 15 acre grids at 18 inches. 00:10:32 We take a apl a plug out every 18 inches. We then measure about 27 different points on that plug, um, of soil test, of, of soil health data to show that 00:10:43 that plug has actually, that spot on that field is actually where it is today and where it is a year from now, 00:10:48 and where it is two years from now and three years from now. That all gets piped up to our portal called Horizons, 00:10:52 which is our, which is an app that we've, we've created and on Horizons, as long as you're on the Holgan program, you'll have access to this. 00:10:59 Where we give you all that soil health data at 15 acre grid, you know, every 15 acres. 00:11:05 We take a, we take a core. We also tying that into, um, aerial photography that's giving us all of the satellite imagery of that field 00:11:13 with four flyovers a year. And we can show it, you know, seasonally where it's, where that field's gone this year, next year, the year after. 00:11:19 Uh, and then we also, if, you know, when the, when the growers give us access, we, we also use the telematics off of the farm, off the tractor, 00:11:25 like the my John Deere or what have you. And, and that all gets put into the same portal. We can then take all of that data, look at it 00:11:33 and help, help the farmers see that we are making progress in soil health. There is improvements in the economic engine of the farm. 00:11:38 They can make better decisions. Ultimately, it's also the equity value of the farm. As we continue to drive productivity, we can show that 00:11:46 that lands worth more money. Um, and, and we can harvest other assets like carbon credits as an example, because we've proven 00:11:52 that those things have all, all happened. So it, it really changed the entire business. It didn't changed how we talk about it. 00:11:56 It also changed the decisions we make. It changed how we direct our resources. And fundamentally, Damien, I would say that if we can't help 00:12:03 a farmer make more money year over year and show them that they made more money, we don't deserve to come back on the farm the next year. 00:12:10 That's it. We either help make more money or we don't. And if we do, then I'd like to come back on the farm with more acres. 00:12:15 And if we don't, you know, we'll put our money where our mouth is and we'll, we'll, we'll figure out why we didn't and, 00:12:21 and, uh, give 'em free product or whatever we have to do. Um, or we'll excuse ourselves 00:12:25 'cause we can't add value, we shouldn't be there. Well, that's The fundamental obviously, that, uh, you know, 00:12:29 at some point you realize, uh, if I don't, if I don't deliver, if I don't deliver on this, then why the hell would you come back? 00:12:36 Temple? You're writing down notes over there. First off, your daughter came in. Yeah. I don't know if you know Barrett, 00:12:42 his daughter Madeline, she, She's screaming at me. She believes himself to be The pipes. The pipes just bursted in the cowboy. So, yeah. 00:12:50 Yeah. So snap There's not a lot I can do about it right now. You know, I get people that hard time me 00:12:55 that I'm not a real farmer because I'm wintering in Arizona and I'll take the abuse, I'll take the abuse. 00:13:02 'cause you know what, and the 19 over What I'm getting ready to go through The 1970s and eighties, I was out there. 00:13:07 I remember laying in frozen cow s**t on my back with a flashlight under a waterer, trying to get it thawed out, and then also pipe snapping 00:13:18 and then water, water blowing on you, and then you freeze. Yeah. You can't do that stuff with mittens on. 00:13:23 So your, your hands, you get to where you can't feel, I don't miss any part of that. I really don't miss any. Yeah. 00:13:28 I'm getting, I'm getting ready to go through it. As soon as we get done here, I'm gonna tell you all about, I'll call you later, tell you all about it. 00:13:33 Take videos, take videos of It. I'll tell you, I, being in northeast and, and, and plumbing problems, I, I can feel your pain there. 00:13:39 Uh, temple, one time I was laying under a crawl space fixing a, a leaky pipe on, on an old house we had. And, and it was freezing and all 00:13:47 of a sudden it started getting really warm. And I thought, wow, this is, this is, maybe I'm getting used to this, and what, and then I heard my wife 00:13:53 scream, fire, fire. What I had, what had actually happened was the first two, two floors of the house were on, we're on fire, 00:13:59 and I'm laying the crawlspace underneath the fire. Um, so that good place to be wasn't our biggest problem. Yeah. 00:14:05 Wow. Yeah. Oh, hey, by the way, based on what you just described, I, uh, I hope you got out of the crawlspace. 00:14:11 And when she said, we need to call 9 1 1, I'm like, yeah, in a couple hours, let's just, let's just go ahead. 00:14:16 Let's just go ahead and let this thing play itself out. So I, Yeah. Oh, 00:14:21 Lord. Economic, I did get out safely and the, and the house did, did go up in total smoke. 00:14:25 It was a, it was a do over, but everybody, everybody's healthy. Yes. Good. The economics of this, before you go 00:14:32 and repair your, uh, frozen pipes in the barn, did you, at least did, did you tell your daughter at least how to shut off the main valve? 00:14:37 It's not still blowing, right? I just told her to turn off all the breakers in the barn. You're good. And then we'll, 00:14:42 we'll, we'll fix it in a minute. Okay. So anyway, let's talk about the economics of this whole thing. First off, it's a long haul picture, like you said, 00:14:50 the cumulative effect of 30 years of bad habits. Then there's seeing, and this is the tough part, you got farmer economics 00:14:57 that are not really good right now in 20 25, 20 26, you've got, uh, a whole bunch of companies out here saying, Hey, we got this new product. 00:15:05 There's a little bit of skepticism. And then there's the reality of the moment versus the long haul. 00:15:10 Tough to do. Tough to have the long, the, the long game picture. No, I, I, I mean, I was gonna say that 00:15:17 that was one of the things I wrote down. You know, this is a longer play. This isn't a, a one stop shop. 00:15:23 I don't think it's, you know, like year one. I think that the product definitely pays for itself without a doubt. 00:15:31 Um, you gotta be willing and depending on what environment you are in, to pull back enough input somewhere else 00:15:37 to put this into play to make it work out. So I think year one, that's where you are. And then, you know, when you get in year 2, 3, 4, 00:15:47 it things are happening. Like, and you can literally see them happening. Um, is there other places that we can put this, 00:15:54 where we make better money? Um, you know, there's a ton of biology companies, you know, if you just wanna classify all of them under that, 00:16:02 that have no background, right? It's a wild, wild west, really. And they just, the products aren't cheap. 00:16:12 They are what they are. There's a lot of research behind this product, and that's what I love about it. 00:16:18 But when Barrett came up with having, you know, and his team coming up with having a program that helps you, you know, not only quantify this, 00:16:28 but you know, being able to sell some of the carbon credits on top of it, and you really get to see a return on your investment. 00:16:37 You get to the point where, um, where I'm at, right? So the point where I'm that is, I don't wanna say this 'cause it sounds wrong. 00:16:46 I don't care about the carbon credits really at this point. I care about the sole health 00:16:50 because it's made that big of a difference in my program now. But the carbon credit, the 00:16:56 Carbon credits basically then Barrett can say to you or to a farmer, a carbon credit payment is going to offset this thing over here. 00:17:06 So then there's the long term, but then there's the short term. Yes. The short term yes. I'm guessing is that the pitch? 00:17:11 They're the car, the short, the carbon payment is the short term to justify the acquisition of the product. 00:17:16 The long term is the improvement of the asset and your Yeah. So it, it's a little different way to look at it. 00:17:21 I think from my point of view, you know, we, we have plenty of customers that use this without 00:17:25 being part of the carbon program. And we pay for ourselves year one in pure soil health improvements because we can typically drive enough efficiency 00:17:33 and fertilizer to more than pay for the product. We typically see yield improvement. That's money back in the farmer's pocket. 00:17:39 Carbon credits aside. When we can also help that, that farmer harvest and carbon carbon credits, 00:17:44 it gives them an economic incentive to make some more significant moves towards soil health. So if you were to enter the carbon program, 00:17:51 and it's not a requirement, it's an op, it's an option. Um, but if you do enter our carbon program, you know, you do have to do things like move towards minimal till 00:17:59 not all of our customers move to minimal till they don't. If you want to do full till, you can do full till, 00:18:03 we're still gonna help you drive soil health. We'll help you do it quicker. If you can reduce your tillage, if you're willing to do that 00:18:08 and let us monitor the, the farm for, for several years as part of the carbon contract, well then we can, we can also help you monetize carbon credits. 00:18:17 So I think the carbon credit monetization is a way to get people to jump in quicker with, with bigger moves in soil health and practices. 00:18:26 Um, but the product itself will pay for itself in year one with or without carbon credits. 00:18:31 Got it. To me, it just prove, it just kind of proves the point. Like, if you're gonna get into a carbon program, 00:18:40 this is a easy way to get into a carbon program to monetize something. And the proof's in the pudding, they've done it long enough 00:18:49 where there's enough research that, you know, it's improving soil health and you're being able to monetize 00:18:55 something else along with it. But like, like I said, I, I'm at the point that if the carbon credit thing kind of went away, 00:19:04 I don't know that it matters to me at this point. Like, we're finding enough places that I can use this product. 00:19:09 You know, right now we're in a, you know, for instance, you know, I I, I did some testing this year and I kind of utilize the product a little bit differently. 00:19:17 I wanted to try some new and different things. And I just feel like any chi, any time that we can get the product out there on the sole, 00:19:28 we're seeing more improvements and more improvement. So maybe there's a way to even get there quicker. Because I, I made one pass in a y drop 00:19:39 where I put the spring product on and I put it in my Y drop and I got a eight bushel bump and, and, 00:19:46 and that I would've never got. Like, and I put it on quite a few acres. Like that's a, that's a major deal to me, 00:19:52 like a, a huge deal. What's the, um, what's the reception like, uh, Barrett, you've been out here for a while 00:20:01 and obviously you're a business guy. Which one gets the biggest, uh, excitement from a, a producer? 00:20:08 Is it, um, the immediate economics, or, I mean, 'cause there's, there's people that give lip service to soil health. 00:20:15 There's people that, but the reality is they're sitting there looking at their bottom line, uh, and we know that. So like, kind of tell me where this, 00:20:23 where this thing goes from the, when you have the value proposition, what's the thing that a producer gets excited about? 00:20:29 Yeah, I think, look, I think every single grower that is growing on a piece of ground that's been in their family for multiple generations, 00:20:37 they all care about the soil health background more than anybody else in the entire planet. 00:20:41 So they, they do care. And I think they generally try to do the right things to drive soil health, but they are forced 00:20:48 to make economic decisions that, that drive the p and l this year. Um, and so sometimes they have to make decisions, do I, 00:20:55 do I drive the p and l this year so I can keep keeping my debt ratio and, and keep the farm for another year? 00:21:01 Or do I make an investment in soil health and think I'm doing something, you know, that could be beneficial to us four or five years from now? 00:21:08 And so it's a hard decision for a farmer to make. Um, they all wanna make the long-term decision. What we try to do is we try to be that hack that helps them 00:21:17 not take the risk of the four to five year decision, but actually monetize it this year so that we can actually have the best of both worlds. 00:21:23 Mm-hmm. It's no compromises. Let's, let's make sure we make the p and l work this year. And while we're doing that, let's start 00:21:31 that flywheel of soil health. It'll, it'll pay for itself this year. If we do it two years, it'll get better. 00:21:36 If we do it three years, it'll get better. So it's a flywheel. Every time you put energy in that flywheel, you, that flywheel goes a little faster. 00:21:41 It goes a little faster. And so what we try to do is, is try to show growers how they can start the journey today without taking an 00:21:49 economic risk this year. And four or five years from now, they won't even recognize their farm. 00:21:55 It'll be that much different. And I'll tell you, it it, I saw a visual of this at, at Temple's farm this year when we, when he had the, uh, 00:22:02 grower meeting, if anybody was there at temple, you wanna tell a story about how much rain we had and the fact that we weren't sure 00:22:07 we're gonna have a meeting? Yeah. So we, um, the night before the meeting, you know, we always have the, you know, the, the member sponsored dinner, um, the night before. 00:22:17 Mm-hmm. And there was a ton of people there, and it absolutely poured buckets of rain. We got five inches of rain within Hmm. 00:22:27 Hour and a half, two hours about what it was. Yeah. Mm-hmm. And it was still light outside. 00:22:33 And we looked out across the field and where the plot was, and then where the field day was at. 00:22:39 We were under solid water. Like, I mean, the whole thing, it looked like a 10 acre pond. 00:22:45 And I was like, man, I don't know that this thing is gonna work out. Like it's gonna be bad the next day. 00:22:51 There was no water on the field. It was, it all receded. And that's a testament to soil health 00:22:57 because that soil opened up, it let it go. We didn't have a hard pan, and everything kind of drained off the field, 00:23:06 and the field was right back vibrant and was going again. So it really is a testament to what, what things can change. 00:23:13 Like it can change. And like Barrett said, you'll get to a point where you don't recognize your farm because it changed something 00:23:20 that you didn't even know that it could change Water infiltration, and I've been sort of keen on this because from the time I was a little kid, we talked about, 00:23:29 uh, putting in tile and, you know, there was like, I'm old enough to remember old dudes that like put in tile by hand, right. 00:23:38 You know, that kind of thing. And then you start learning more about, well, part of the water problem is compaction 00:23:44 and then degradation of the soil structure, et cetera, et cetera. What you just talked about, right? 00:23:48 There was a water infiltration situation. And that speaks to the bigger picture. It's not necessarily organics. 00:23:54 That's the whole, uh, the whole, the whole whole view picture, if you will, of what temples do. 00:24:01 And Barrett is increasing soil health, increases water infiltration, which then is good for crops, which then, et cetera, farm ability, all those things. 00:24:09 And let me give you some metrics to tie back to this. So we talk about carbon and you know, there are people out there 00:24:15 that think we should take carbon outta the atmosphere. And there are people that argue that maybe we don't need to take carbon atmosphere. 00:24:21 I'm here to say, let's, let's not have that argument. Here's what I absolutely know is when we put carbon in the ground, 00:24:27 we take it outta the atmosphere and we put it into the ground. We improve organic matter in 00:24:31 that soil carbon is the fundamental building block to, to improving organic matter. When we improve organic matter, uh, we get better, 00:24:38 healthier soil that does a bunch of really cool things, one of which is improves water holding capacity. 00:24:44 So if we can improve wa organic matter by one percentage point, we go from from two to 3% or three to 4% every time we add one percentage point 00:24:51 of organic matter, which is coming from carbon coming outta the air and going into the ground among other things, 00:24:56 you improve that, that soil's water holding capacity by 25,000 gallons per acre. Every point of organic matter is 25,000 gallons per acre. 00:25:04 Additional water holding capacity. So I was talking to one of our long-term growers, I said, Hey, how much, how much rain did you get yesterday? 00:25:11 It looks like you guys have had a, a chance of some rain. He says, I got all of it. I said, you got all of it? 00:25:16 He said, yeah, I'm using organic. Said, all went right down into the, into the ground and we're holding onto it. 00:25:20 It did. None of it washed away. Yeah. So that's, that's a testament to that, uh, improvement in water holding capacity and, 00:25:24 and that organic matter and, and how it relates. Carbon, The numbers you just gave are kind of fun. 00:25:29 You said if I could, if I increase by one percentage 0.0, more organic matter, my water holding capacity 00:25:35 or infiltration, whatever, we're talking about the same thing, soak in, soak in ability. 00:25:40 Mm-hmm. Right. Improves by how many gallons? 25,000 gallons per acre, which Is roughly an acre, which is roughly an inch over an acre. 00:25:47 That's right. Yeah. All right. So that's, that's the big, that's the big takeaway there. 00:25:52 Temple, you're giving yourself credit for all that. You improving your, by the way, if you're watching this, I apologize, Zoom's doing something funny here. 00:25:58 It's zooming in and out. Sometimes it's like it's zooming in on a zit on my forehead and sometimes it's out here. 00:26:02 I'm sorry about that. If you're watching this, I'm gonna get this fixed. Trust me over the next time you watch this. 00:26:06 Um, so the big picture here is where do you go A few years from now, you've been using their product for a few years. 00:26:12 You've, you've been cutting back on inputs. You've been big on soil health. You are taking the long term view. 00:26:18 You did, you were forced 20, 30 years ago to start doing nutrient management plans because of the Chesapeake Bay Watershed. 00:26:25 It's stuff that we've covered on different, uh, recordings of this. Take me five to 10, if we're talking long view. 00:26:30 Take me five years down the road, Five years down the road. You know, Barrett just talked about, you know, 00:26:36 improving the organic matter and improving, you know, the water holding capacity. What you're not talking about is the efficiency 00:26:45 of fertilizer when, or fertility in general that's in your soil, that when you improve your organic matter, all 00:26:52 of those things change. It improves the fact that, you know, nitrogen, look how volatile nitrogen is, right? 00:26:59 It's, it, it is an efficient product, but it's so volatile. It gets outta your soil so quickly and it gets away from us. 00:27:06 So for me, every time that I can improve that, I approve the efficiency of all my fertility as well. So maybe we get to a point 00:27:14 where I can start cutting back some more fertility. Um, also for me, like learning how to utilize the product in different areas. 00:27:24 Right now it's a two-part program, right? So after we take our, our, our harvest off in the, in the fall, we apply a product, right? 00:27:33 And it helps break the residue down. It's doing a great job. It's a little bit tough sometimes to get 00:27:40 that sprayer back out of the field or out of the, out of the shed and Chase combines. Um, and then in the spring they have a spring product, 00:27:48 and the spring product like literally wakes up the ground. Like, I mean, I can't tell you 00:27:53 how much it wakes up the ground. You gotta see it to believe it. And it really does. I aided that spring product into my Y drop 00:28:02 and it improved again, eight bushels. And it was on a test plot that I did on my farm. It was also in a 40 acre trial over on another farm. 00:28:13 And it was the same numbers. So for me, being able to utilize the, the program, but maybe take it another step, right? 00:28:22 And find something else that will even benefit more. So I already did the fall and the spring program, it was already beneficial. 00:28:32 It already improved. I just ate it another eight bushel, somewhere in the middle, maybe figuring out 00:28:40 that we have other places that we can put it. Maybe we're even better. Yeah, there's no doubt about it. 00:28:47 We do a lot of, we're doing a lot of testing on different kinds of efficacy on multiple applications, different rates 00:28:52 where we get the biggest ROI on a consistent basis. Um, and there is situations where more applications can, can give us a bigger win. 00:29:00 Um, we just have to dial it in to where we can look the farm, the grower in the eye and say, we know for sure 00:29:05 that in this situation we're gonna get a bigger win. And then you're gonna see us start to recommend that type of thing. 00:29:09 Today, it's in some situations the second application really works like what you saw Temple. 00:29:14 Other situations, we may not get enough of an ROI to justify it, right? So we've been conservative in our recommendations, 00:29:20 but, uh, certainly there's other ways to use the product. All right? So going, and I'll tell you our, our, 00:29:24 our buery growers, our tomato growers, they're using it much more frequently than our row crop growers. 00:29:29 And that's just a totally different crop and a totally different way to use it. S**t. I'm holding up my whole organics pen once more. 00:29:36 Uh, I got a question for you, Barry. All right. Same, same thing for you. It's cool to say we've changed our philosophy here. 00:29:42 We obviously, we, we are selling products, but we're you knowability partnering soil health, all those things, but you do have 00:29:49 to be at the forefront of stuff. So take me five years from now, i I bump into you at Commodity Classic five years from now, 00:29:56 and I want you to tell me, 'cause you still do have to have products and you do have to be at the front end, 00:30:00 and you are measuring and you are doing some really cool stuff. And I've witnessed it and I've already, uh, you know, said 00:30:05 that that's, it sets you apart five years from now. What's the new product? What is the thing that you're doing five years from now? 00:30:11 What are you offering Temple five years from now? So fundamentally, you know, we're still, I still think we'll be on the mission of how can we continue 00:30:20 to be a stronger and stronger partner to the grower in driving soil health. That's our space. We want to be the soil health company, 00:30:28 especially when it comes to understanding the rise ophere and the microbiome and how they, uh, all interact. 00:30:35 And so all of our studies and all of our, uh, r and d and, and, um, and the, the pipe, the product pipeline 00:30:42 that we're developing all has to do with really understanding that r ophere, that that first five, six inches of the soil, 00:30:49 what's going on there at a microbio microbiological level, we need, what are the microbes that are, 00:30:54 that are present or not present? And, and what are the correlations that are happening based on those, the observations? 00:31:00 What are the biochemicals and the biomarkers that are also showing up in the, in certain situations of either deficits or abundance, 00:31:10 and how to understand the correlation between those things. So fundamentally 00:31:14 what we're gonna do is we're gonna keep getting smarter and smarter and smarter about the r ophere and how to take a more prescriptive model towards different 00:31:21 deficiencies in different soil health situations. So today we, we have product, our fundamental technology is called BI 800. 00:31:28 Uh, and BI 800 is because we use over 800 species of bacteria, fungi, aba, protozoa in some ways, uh, Damien, 00:31:34 we're throwing the kitchen sink at the soil to make sure we got it covered. Um, as we continue to get smarter, 00:31:40 we'll probably figure out ways to have a, a super effect on super soils with maybe a subset of that consortium. 00:31:49 And then we need to basically, uh, you know, bring the populations up in, in this, in situation A and situation B, we need a whole nother subset 00:31:57 that's got a high population for, for helping that particular customer for that particular deficit. 'cause look, soil's not the same from, 00:32:04 you know, North Dakota to Texas. Um, if I just take the center part of the country, um, and the ability to affect those 00:32:12 soil types differently are gonna, are gonna, we're gonna, as we get smarter and smarter, we're gonna be able 00:32:16 to affect them differently and more dramatically. I also think there's an opportunity to think about different genetics and what genetics of corn 00:32:23 or beans, uh, need, what microbes to thrive. And we're gonna start to learn that as well. Um, we also have a bio nematicide in our pipeline 00:32:31 that we could, that we could, we actually have the data on it today. We could launch it as a product tomorrow. 00:32:36 We need to take it through the EPA registration process. I say launch it tomorrow. 00:32:40 Technically I can launch it tomorrow from a, from a, from a feasibility perspective. But I have to go through the EPA registration process, 00:32:46 which is a three year process. So that's another product we have in the pipeline that's ready to go, but we gotta go through, uh, regulation. 00:32:53 I like it. I think we'll leave it there. Temple, you got anything to add? Five years from now? We gave, we gave the protection. 00:33:00 Um, five from five from from now You're gonna have your first grade Five all starting kindergarten. 00:33:05 Yeah, how about that? Yep. Starting today, right. So I, I really like what Barrett was talking about because every soul isn't different. 00:33:13 I mean, is is very different, I should say. And maybe the reason that I got such a dramatic effect out of an extra application, maybe it is a more of, 00:33:25 of a prescriptive environment, right? When we find out and the more data that they take, that's what I love about this company. 00:33:31 You know, this company is very, it imagine how any family farm runs, right? Where it's very family oriented. 00:33:40 That's what I love about the company. Like, you get into this company, it's, it's really like you feel like you are part of a family 00:33:48 and they're going somewhere and they're all data and research, um, driven. Like they are very driven in a mission. 00:33:55 So when you get to that point and you get involved with them, um, and you start to learn about your own soul, 00:34:02 when we talk about that, we can start to talk about an actual prescription that works for your soul that maybe they can kind 00:34:10 of speed up the process of what's going on here. I I love it. I absolutely love it. I wanna learn more about this. Where do I go? Mr. Barrett? 00:34:20 Good@organics.com. Check out our website. Uh, we, we did a major rebrand this year to tie in that whole driveability, uh, movement. 00:34:28 And there's a video that, uh, they can click on that's just a quick two minute video that really gives you a high level of 00:34:33 what profitability means to us. organics.com. H-O-L-G-A-N-I-X is the company we're joined by. Barrett ic, the founder of Hogans. 00:34:43 Uh, and, uh, and a fun dude to be at field days with. If you want to, if you want to, uh, learn more about them, you can go to their website. 00:34:49 If you wanna check out other stuff, go to the, the videos. You know, we've got a whole library of videos 00:34:53 that we put on Extreme Mag Farm stuff that Temple has shot at his farm. Stuff that I've done with these guys at the field days. 00:34:58 Just go on the extreme Mag Farm and you can go on the search engine, just type in organics and you'll see all that stuff. 00:35:03 Or type in Temple Field Day and you'll find stuff from there. Uh, it's a library of information. 00:35:07 There's hundreds of these episodes. We've been doing this for almost five years now, and, uh, it's all free. 00:35:11 So go check it out@extremeag.farm. If you wanna become a member, it's only seven $50 a year for you to become a member of extreme ag. 00:35:17 It's, uh, it comes with a lot of benefits. You can go to the data conference for free. You can go to Commodity Classic for free 00:35:23 because of our partners and nature's paying for that. There's a lot of great information. Plus you can get access to, uh, 00:35:28 the trial at the end of the year. So go check all that out at Extreme Magnet Farm until next time. 00:35:32 That's Temple Roads with Chestnut Mariner Farms. He's gonna go and fix some, he's gonna go and get really, really cold and fix some snap pipes. 00:35:38 Yep, I'm getting ready to get, and you know what? One thing he's gonna realize, Barrett, he's gonna realize just like I did, hey, 00:35:45 this is neat playing cowboy, but right now I can't feel my fingers. It's not right now. And I think I'm getting hypothermia. 00:35:52 So like that summer day when you're drinking a beer, looking out at the cattle and the pasture, that's cool. But then you remember mm-hmm. Day in December when you're 00:36:00 laying on frozen cow manure, um, with, with a hair dryer trying to get something thawed. You can't feel your fingers and it 00:36:07 yeah, I understand all that. Anyway, so next time, thanks for being here. That's Bear, that's Temple. I'm Damian Mason 00:36:11 with Extreme Ice Kind in the curve. That's a wrap for this episode of Cutting the Curve. Make sure to check out Extreme ag.farm 00:36:17 for more great content to help you squeeze more profit out 00:36:21.245 --> 00:36:22.525